Exclusive Psalmody 101: Should Christians Sing Only Psalms?

0:00 Well, hey, Zach. Hey, Michael. We have been posting a lot of shorts lately. Man, cranking it up. Yeah, yeah. And we have noticed that we've gotten some new subscribers. So new subscribers welcome to our channel. And looking at some of the the analytics that we see may be the fact that, you know, new people kind of like what we're talking about, the shorts, but they don't really know us. They may not care about 20 minutes of elementary school soccer. Kindergarteners playing soccer and our tactics. Yeah, yeah, cut out. But we're not going to totally cut out the funny business. No, yeah, we we need the funny business, but we thought maybe we'll just put that at the end. I.

0:42 Think you still take it or leave it? Yeah, yeah, yeah. You don't have to suffer what somebody might say through 10 minutes of, you know, whatever. Probably a Patriots talk, unfortunately, in the near future. I like it. So just short and sweet. We're going to get into it. Yeah. What are we talking about today? So we just came off of an interview that we did actually a little bit of a while ago, but it just aired last last week with Tim, you know, listen back to it. You know, sometimes you listen back to our show. I was like, oh, that's a that's a pretty good show, Tim. Yeah, that's great. Tim had a lot of wise things to say. It's like when you're in the middle of an interview, sometimes you're thinking about your next question more than what the answer is. But you know, when you're just a listener, you can kind of sit back. I thought, OK, there's some good stuff there. A lot of wisdom was used a lot out there. Totally.

1:30 And a big and a big part of that was like music. Bethel Hillsong, like that was like something we talked about a decent amount. Right. Yeah. And so out of this, we're going to talk about hymnity. And not just hymnity, not just the H. No. But the EH, exclusive enmity. Yeah, even even exclusive psalmity. Psalmity. That's that's what it's great. Because that would be the, the maybe overcorrection, maybe not, but that that would be like, hey, we're getting a we're not going to leave what we talked about last episode even to chance. We don't have to have discernment. Right, you don't. No wisdom if we just stay with maybe. Yeah, we can.

2:14 We can. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. But but but that's what we're talking about exclusive psalmody one O 1 kind of the basics and overview. Let's go ahead. Let's exit in the next level. Let's fire up that twanga music. From the hearts of the Low Country in South Carolina. It's the Take Two podcast where we take theology to the next level. I don't know how you could go wrong. Actually, I didn't even even saying that. I think I do know how you could go wrong, but let me just straw man. I don't know how you could go wrong just singing psalms. Right on. On its surface actually seems like really solid. There's 150 to choose from.

2:56 There you go. Got some variety, a lot of different spectrums you could hit, you know? Most of them are probably fine. Most. Yeah, most. Most are probably really good. And we know we talked about Bethel Hillsong. What an elevation. Just name a few. But to to be to be fair, there's some hymns that have some authors that also went off the rails later in life as well with their theology or with their walk with Christ altogether. Just that's just the. Character outside of the song and we talked about this a little bit, we did bring up reckless love. That's like one of the ones where people really some people like not even on their mind. Some people are like, oh, reckless is that's right.

3:37 Some people are like, you know, put yourself in this perspective. Some people like we should never stay reckless. And it is, you know. It, it was it. I don't think it was a divisive song, but it divided the church because there were some strong and seemed to kind of polarize people. Like either people were like, Oh yeah, it's great. Yeah, this is horrible. Yeah, a song that came to my mind. It was popular when I was younger. I think it was popularized, maybe, but I don't think you wrote it. But Michael W. Smith, do you know the song above all? I do. I saw it in the notes and I was like what's wrong with that 'cause I was just thinking about the verses the. Verses are awesome and then the ends like like a rose. Trampled. On the ground. On the ground. He took the fall.

4:18 He took the fall and thought of me above. All and and and so that came like when I was putting together some of these notes, I was like, that's the one that comes to my mind. Like we saying, but I can see people and I've heard people say they have problems with it really focusing on it's not about you, it's the glory of God. And that was #1 I, I think if you're. I think you could think thoughts of the people. I'm sure that he thought of the people he was dying for. Totally. But I'd be hard pressed to say above all. And, and I, and I think that's where it gets tricky, 'cause I on one hand I am very analytical and to me my mind's like, I don't even want to sing that because I don't want to even think that. I think with songs, poetry, you do need to be charitable to like and the like some of this word play and stuff and and if you're looking.

5:09 Just tweaked the words and thought of me amongst all or something like that. See, that would be good because I think, like you said, if you read the entirety of that song, it's like awesome. And it's probably like maybe thought of you above. Like the rest of the creation keys above all majesty and you know it, like it. It really puts up Christ at a very pentacle, and then it just puts you just slightly higher, just. Yeah, yeah. And and so I'm sure Michael W but whoever actually wrote it, I don't think it was him like I don't I think their goal was to exalt Christ probably above man like they weren't That's not what they were thinking. I'd guarantee it almost. But you do exclusive somity you you you know, you get away from that. You don't have to worry about human error drifting and similar to it's a little different because of this is not scripture, but you know, Presbyterians that are like hey or Baptist that are like 1689. We got the Westminster Confession of Faith. Like, read that.

6:02 Don't read what me and five guys sat around a table and said about the Trinity because it could be wrong. I mean, you know what I mean? Like and you'll get some of these, you know? Westminster confession could not be wrong. Right. I, I, I, I think I as as long as faithful description writes the caveat. But it's like, yeah, it's like these kind of things you kind of get these guardrail. So let's talk about it. Let's define it. What is exclusive psalmody? So exclusive psalmody, if it kind of is self-explanatory, but it's where that you would only, you know, use the Psalms of Scripture if you're going to sing corporately in a worship setting and then it's grounded in the strict application of this regulative principle of worship. That's good because I think most conservative Bible and Christians would be like, I believe the regular principle, like everyone wants to claim that. From themselves regulative principle of worship. God has prescribed how he would like to be worshipped and don't deviate from that versus the normative principle. It was like if you didn't say don't do it, have at it. And and most people, I think, and then there's like, is this accidental?

7:09 Like is it a Pew or chair? They would say that's accident. That doesn't really matter. That's not like really at the essence of it, you know, but all that to say that that's what they're appealing to man. We're God wants to be worshipped a certain way. We have his words like let's not get crazy with things. Yeah, so I, I, I hear all that and I wanted, I'd want to, I guess I'm, I'm somewhere in the middle because I wouldn't say whatever goes is fine. But I would say that what people, I would probably think that his, his defining of what we should be doing is probably less restrictive than what most people would would say.

7:51 You know, I would want to look at the passages that they say this applies totally. Are are you for real? Are you sure that that's for for today? I and I feel like when you get into the weeds, it's like, what are you talking about? And at some point you do pick and choose like can you use a microphone? Can you not cause a lot of people would be like, that's fine, but you know what I mean when it gets down to some of it. And so because of that, a lot of these denominations that that continue to do this, they're, they're also going to be like, Hey, we're good with iambic pentameter. We're not, we don't need any, you know, accompany it. It's acapella, acapella essentially in I think it's founded in goodwill. You know, we just want to be faithful to scripture and but they'll stand behind that, which I think, you know, most of us are not going to.

8:37 We're like, we're, we're being faithful to scripture too, right? We're, we're still claiming that it's kind of like the moral high ground that we'd be OK. We're we're kind of on your side in the way we're not trying to circumvent anything that Scripture is forbidding or anything like that. All right, so how long is this exclusive psalmody been around? What's it's it's been around for at least a minute. I know the high point when it was in its heyday. It's going back to the Reformation. If you look at the the denominations that practice today, most of them are of the reformed persuasion. I, I, I, it is still a minority position in the Reformed community, but that's kind of they're saying, man, John Calvin knew what was going on.

9:18 Let's that Geneva Salter. Let's sing from that. Was it some of the pushback against? The. I think Catholic Church of the you know, the different songs that they wrote then I. I think, I think a lot, I think you look at a lot of these things like no images of like all you almost go down and it's some of it's good, some of it's like indifferent. But I think it, I think you're right that it's like, oh, Catholicism is doing this. We're doing the opposite. You know, it's like we're all going to grow up this. Facial hair. It's the opposite of what the Catholic Roman Catholic Church. Exactly. They're all clean shaven. We're going to get all these beards. It's just like you try to. They're not. It's like all these things. And I think this is one of those things. So we can, we can kind of go through, I mentioned John Calvin 15 hundreds, 1551, the Genevan Psalter came out and really this became kind of the model across Europe for a reformed worship that we're, you know, looking to Calvin as one of these leaders that is standing in the face of. And we're using Scripture cause Scripture's at the center. We don't, you know, focus totally on the mass or these kind of things.

10:19 And are they putting the I got? Obviously, they're probably not singing Greek. Yeah, I think you're probably right. Yeah, probably right. So this time are they sing in Latin you think still, or they singing in their own tongue, German? I mean, Martin Luther writes a mighty fortress. That's true. That's a little division from Calvin, where he is, you know, you know, Martin Luther always pushing the boundary. He's really going crazy. I I don't know that for a fact I'd be interested that it would be in their own tongue, because that's also like a break from the Catholic Church. Well, let's assume it's in the the common tongue. I'm assuming they're not singing like word for word what's in the Psalm.

11:00 Someone's having to meter that. So it fits into like 'cause it's metered in Hebrew, but typically unless you're really working at it. How are you going to make it all like fit? Yeah. So someone's got to make some some, yeah. I think you're, I think you're probably right. And that's where these psalters maybe there's some editing in the actual Psalters and that that kind of thing we. Got John Calvin. We got. We got. 1551. 1564, the Scottish Reformation, the Church of Scotland that they actually formally adopted exclusive solemnity. So a lot of the denominations that still practice that kind of come from that Scottish kind of background. It was like, not just something we do, it's the only thing we do when it comes to corporate.

11:41 Was that referenced in Braveheart or no? I missed that scene. Give me my freedom and my Psalter. Yeah, there you go. All right. And then Next up we have the Scottish, Scottish metrical Psalter. I love it. That's very good. 1650, so about 100 years later, a high watermark of the exclusive psalmody in the English speaking world. So I'm assuming these these Scottish ones are in, in Scott or you know, something that's very close to, to English today. Totally. And even the drift like Puritans, the Presbyterians, you know, 17th century, a lot, a lot of these churches and people at least assumed it.

12:22 Maybe it wasn't exclusive, but psalmody was a, a big part of their worship. It wasn't like this outlier like today. It's kind of French. I don't know if you've met people that practice this exclusive. I know knew one person who advocated for it, but yeah, yeah, yeah. I don't know of anyone who practice it. And so it was really, it was really the norm. And so it's interesting to see like, when did this like tip like, you know? Well, something's going on around 1600. There's like this massive migration from the European continent to this new world. That's right. And so these Puritans are going to take that over there with with them to the new world, right? Day that that could be, that could be a big, big, big thing. And maybe around the early to mid 1700s we do see a little bit of a shift because, and I think this is one of the if you're going to say there's a problem with exclusive psalmody, I think it's good.

13:20 This is a really good argument against it. The church really wanted more and more songs that mentioned Christ, that mentioned the Christ. Seems like you'd want a song about, you know, the second person, especially the Messiah. Coming out of all this, it's like systematics institutes, like like you're starting to develop doc, like really strong resurgence of doctrine and, you know, opposition of Catholicism. You want to sing about the Trinity, you want to sing about the resurrection and you implicitly you, you can, but it's not like that bold new covenant or like just really, really seeing it. And you could see like, that's kind of a gap. Yeah, you couldn't say 1 little word shall fail him like you do.

14:02 And yes, yeah, yeah. Yeah, and so we have the rebel of all rebels. Oh man, I just watch. Sticking it. Speaking truth to power. Dude, I love this and really what prompted this? One of the things that prompted this episode was our joy to the world episode, Isaac Watts, Cuz if you talk to anyone today, what a great hymn writer like, and this day people are like, don't listen to Isaac Watts. You know, he's, he's kind of out there rebelling and pushing these evil hymns. And it's like so funny the different context where it's like he just wrote hymns, man. And not when I survey the wondrous cross toward the world, alas, in my savior bleeder. Oh wow. But it's like these things that no one would have a problem. With, you know, just have an Isaac Watts, you know, that's Sunday that we only sing Isaac Watts songs. That'd be good.

14:51 And he was prolific, so we could do it. So he it was kind of the the turning point, the guy who held up his hand and said, Hey, I'm going to do something about it. And as hymns were initially controversial, banned, Can you imagine like hymns getting like, hey, we don't sing that. Are you listening to that Isaac Watch CD? You know, that's anachronistic. But it's like hilarious that he would be banned today. That is crazy. All right, Yeah. And Speaking of that Joy of the World episode, it it, it's there. You can go back and listen to it. It it has performed, you know, it's gotten a lot of attention, so. What a great, what a great hymn, you know? And, and so as this started happening, exclusive psalmody kind of got replaced by psalms plus hymns in many congregations where, you know, him became more and more commonplace. And and yeah, go ahead.

15:42 Yeah, I was just going to say one of the things we did talk about in the Joy of the World episode was that he was looking at a particular passage. That's right. And he was riding his hymn out of there. And so I think part of the problem is that when you start doing that, that's great. And some people might be more faithful to what's in the Bible than others. And so now we do we have to bring back that wisdom discernment issue. So many songs, a lot good, not good. I will say this, I feel like so many of the songs that I enjoy today, man, they're still pulling from Psalms. Like it's modernized, but it's like you, you recognize these refrains and you're like, oh, that's from one, that's from a Psalm or you know what I mean? It's like they're kind of expounding on that I think when it's done. It's all really well, and the Lord knew what our human frame needed.

16:31 I see, yeah, yeah, though though absolutely true. So I can totally wrap my head around 15 hundreds, 6000 people embracing exclusive psalmody who practices this today? Like who's doing this hardcore? Because there are there are people all. Right, So who's doing it? Today? We have the Reformed Presbyterian Church of North America. The RPC and a. The Reformed Presbyterian Church of Ireland. Oh yeah, nice, you like that. The Reformed Church of Scotland and I even tried to do a Scottish Open for it, continuing in some congregations. Select congregations within the Associated Reformed, Presbyterian, and Old School Presbyterian traditions.

17:17 So probably it's not probably domination to most people are not like, Oh yeah, I know that one. You know, it's it's it's a little bit more fringe today where it was the majority definitely a confessional minority position, not mainstream by by any measure. Many churches still it how culture changes. Most of these Presbyterian churches would say, hey, we subscribe to the regular principle, but the goal posts has have changed, you know what I mean? And I think that that's that's reasonable. We're like, hey, we're still, you know, trying to abide what guide commands and worship 'cause really at its essence, it's hard to define, you know, every little, little thing and you get into these, you know, debates on can you do announcements during church or not or you know what these kind of things, you know, and you're like, and some, some confessional churches say we do announcements after the service or before the service. It's not like it's intentionally not part of the service, which you can say that about Archers, but it's like, it's not like one thing that flows together.

18:16 It's like separate because we want to stay subscribing to this principle, you know what I mean? Yeah, yeah. And I can see, there's like, I can see the concern if you crack the door open for something, then what else can you fit in there? And eventually, you know, there's a continuum where one would say an announcement about a church service later on the week. How could that be disrupted to what God wants to do? Maybe pledge allegiance to the American flag. And then you probably lost half the people there and then half people are like, why wouldn't you say the pledge allegiance to the American flag? You know what I'm saying? And so that would be divisive. But but then as you go over in that, you know, perspective, you know, continuum, you're gonna get to things that everyone will be like, yes, that has no place in Yeah, that's a good point. And so, but again, it's The Who are we as a local body? What are we gonna allow in our, you know, services and what do we find that's good and and not good? 'Cause I was reading in one forum one time where, you know, people were talking about when they did announcements, it was like almost, I love some of these like forms where it's like a gotcha.

19:18 Someone's like, hey, when do you guys do announcements? And someone was like, well, after we're done, like with singing give offering, then we'll do some announcements, then we'll have the message. And he was like breaking the regular principle worship. Like it's almost like, you know, it's like you can't do it in the middle. It has to be beginning or the end. So you know, it's great. So I love it when like a original poster, just like. It's just like a setup laying a. Trap and then like comes like, how could you think that? Like everyone's guard is down? But anyway, the I I think when you think of exclusive psalmody, there is some good watching and I respect it. Like, I don't think that's what everyone needs to do, but Psalms are divinely inspired. They are the word of God. Yeah, hymns.

19:58 How could you ever argue with singing the word of God right? I know. And when you look at Scripture, singing is commanded. Psalms are given as something to be sung, you know, I think there's more to the verse too. So it's like, you know. It's like songs, yeah. Spiritual songs, yeah. Spiritual songs, yeah. And and and Revelation specifically says sing a new song. Sing a new song. There you go man, and. And when you do look at this, Psalter, what it does well, and they'll appeal to this. It covers all these different emotions. There's doctrine, there's lament, there's praise, there's repentance, there's hope. Is there wrath? Do they get the pregatory? That's that's exactly right. And I think Psalter's great for for it does cover the emotions that that's good. I think that's a pro of their argument that it in that way, but they would say, hey, it's sufficient. We don't need to add of it.

20:46 So so let's talk about we mentioned some what what are the pros of exclusive psalmody? Yeah, well, you, you don't have to worry about someone getting doctrine wrong. They may misunderstand the words there, but at least the words, since they're inspired, they're going to get doctrine right. They should get some saturation in Scripture. So like this Sunday we saying that Psalm 90 and I tried to like read from Psalm 90 and I felt like even help me because you know, if I'm dwelling on the Psalm that this is written from and then I go sing it. Oh, I can feel it. So I think there is a goodness there, but I don't I don't think a very pure EP person. I don't know how they would feel about chain in chains Psalm 90 because they are adding some stuff that's New Testament based.

21:37 And when you write, you're singing the Psalms, it's definitely going to be God centered rather than performer centric, which I think that can be like a more global problem in worship. I think you can still be, you know, singing something that can be performer centered. You got this historical background. You know, some people really, especially in the Reformed tradition, it's like you really do want to trace those roots. You know what I mean? Like back to the Reformation and you do have lament, not just triumph, which I think is good. That's a critique I think sometimes of modern worship. You don't you everything's great. Pray to God you'll be a millionaire. Maybe not that explicit, but there's sometimes you struggle more to find songs that really have that lament aspects maybe. Yeah, I was just thinking through what we typically do.

22:18 We we there are some songs we sing that are big on the sovereignty of God. OK, Yeah. And there's some songs that are big on God being president, trials, not necessarily rescuing from trials. Like never once did you leave it, leave us alone. That's great. I remember Leanne saying that was very totally impactful to her at the time. And we sang some songs just as last Sunday. I'm not trying to make this all night of last night, but this was on my mind. No. And I think you're hitting a big point. It's probably, you know, who's leading the worship. Hopefully they're thinking through, I think, and I think most people in this position probably are. I can see some people like I got to get some songs up here. Let's just pick like the big ones.

22:58 Probably most people that go to Bible like word of God and they're, they're really thoughtful about it. But I can see someone, you know, I, I can see it happening more like, oh, I lead a Bible study on a Wednesday night. I work a 80 hour a week job. I'm just trying to like throw a song. I can play Here's as the deer as there's a great song, but it's like you're not thinking about it, which I can tell our worship everyone is. There's a lot of thought behind it. Yeah, I yeah, I do appreciate that amongst our worship. But I was going to say, you know, like this, this song we sing, sovereign, sovereign in the Mountaineer, sovereign on the ocean floor with me in the calm, with me in the storm. Yeah, there is not. Necessarily, but you get some of that, the pattern that, hey, life isn't just a walk of roses.

23:40 That's right. And I think a lot of the a lot of the songs do a good job of maybe there's like an arc to the song, like it starts out tension and maybe you know, and the chorus is more hopeful or something where it's not totally like that. So anyway, those are some pros. Let's get into some cons. What What's the problem or what potential pitfalls may there be with this approach? Well, we don't live underneath the Mosaic Law anymore because, one, we're Gentiles, you and I are. But even for Messianic Jews, they're not living underneath that. And we have more revelation that has hit us, you know, so. It's weird not to sing the name of Christ in a worship. Service.

24:23 Yeah, it's weird. And you're not going to see Jesus in the Psalms written out. That's right. It's implicit, not explicit. You mentioned that new covenant question, you know, and you and you kind of alluded this to does post resurrection worship require a new song? Like I kind of think it does. Like, I think it's great to sing Psalm, but I think I think it's like, man, there's so much more we can sing about and praise God about, or at least in a more full way. We kind of already mentioned this, but there is some difficulty if you do want to sing me in preparatory psalms. And the historical distance requires careful teaching because you know, there there's some harsh things that are said there and you got to think through that. And different people probably have different, you know, ways of thinking through that, but that's probably something you got to do.

25:12 This is not on our list. What I've heard or read people say as a pro con is you're an exclusive somity song. It's no iambic pentameter. You can sing all the song you don't like. Learn these songs. You know, it's like congregational worship, never singing like super high or you know what I mean? Like, oh it's out of range. It's like only the main person on stage can sing it 'cause they're so gifted, but the congregation can't. I think most congregational songs can be adapted or are sung where maybe everyone's not nailing everything, but it's like they're meant to sing as a congregation a lot of. Times, right? There are songs that that I've heard be sung and I'm like, probably not for the congregation. Should've just been a special, what we call a special. I think Tim kept calling it a song of admonishment.

25:54 Oh, that's right. Yeah, that's. Funny in our in our last one, but yeah, that that is a concern for some of the the new stuff. All right, Isaac Watts, the man who asked where is Christ? That's a great question. Like we're he he well, a little background on him. He is like smack dab in well, maybe not. He's from 1674 to 1748. So he's kind of coming 102 hundred years into this, you know, real strong reformation push. He's someone who would he he would, you know, be categorized as an English non conformist, someone who loved the Psalms but really did believe like, man, we're not getting total gospel clarity. We're not getting like everything in here. Where's the cross? And he this quota came across.

26:36 We sing as if Christ had not yet come, which makes sense if you're singing the Psalms. Right. If you're only singing the Psalms and even this, I wonder. Yeah, I need to get a Scottish Psalter and look at this thing and see how, see how they how they like handled Psalm 22. Because you could probably explicitly name Christ there. But if your rule is we're not going to put a word in here that's not in the Psalm, then then you're not going to name Christ for that. I totally agree that it you know, if you're a Christian you should sing as a Christian, not as ancient Israel and so why attempted to bring Christ into the Psalms joy to the world. Great example, what probably is most famous example that I came maybe George was most famous.

27:18 One of his most well done examples was because if you read about him, there is some critique like, oh, I didn't handle this Psalm as well as he probably should have. Psalm 72 is like held up as this one. He did really, really well. Jesus shall reign where the sun is the name of the of the hymn that he wrote. And I'm like that. In case you want to be further reading, check it out. Whatever, I don't know that that's like the one that came up over and over and this is he did so well, like like using the foundation of the Psalm, but incorporating Christ. Yeah, yeah, That, that's really good. I I think we saw the same thing with, you know, joy of the world. Yeah, totally. Yeah. You would want your songs to be theological and logical, and the Psalms anticipate Christ. But you want we since we know Christ came. You want to be able to sing about that fulfillment, and so you need a fuller expression of what the Psalms do on their own. And you, you mentioned it like if I was hearing to, if I was hearing a preacher, a pastor like Psalm 22, I would hope we'd be like doing it through the lens of, of Christ, like, like you would do that with sermons, Like, you know, we, we could do that with songs too, right?

28:33 Right. But it does take some wisdom because. Not. Everyone may not. Just like, just like someone can preach a really bad sermon on Psalm 22, you can write a really bad song on it too, I'm sure. Right, right. So Watts's innovation, he had explicit hymns about the cross, about the resurrection Trinity, which also more fully revealed in the New Testament and the incarnation, which, you know, all of those things. So I'm excited to look at, you know, some hymns of, of Watts and see what he has. Yeah. See what Watts all about. We talked about a lot of these strengths. The critiques from Exclusive Psalmody would say, hey, these are uninspired. You're maybe maybe Watts is nailing it, but who's to say that, you know, Watts Junior or the third's going to like be just as strong directed?

29:21 TJ may not be, may not be nailing it. You know what I'm? Saying if you if you Christianize the Psalm, you might be divorcing it from its original intent. And I think, you know, maybe you could run the risk of that if not done well, but you know, the people that do it well. I think look, if so, so questions. Maybe we're bringing it more today with this tension. You know what, what's it mean to worship faithfully? Can we only use inspired words or, or can you faithfully express inspired truth differently? And, and we would much like our Presbyterian brothers say creeds and confessions are great. They're not the word of God. You alluded this, but but they're good, you know, for the, for the most part, maybe you don't agree with everything, but most, I mean, especially when you get to the early creeds, you're like, man, they're they're nailing it pretty well. Yeah, yeah, Yeah, exactly.

30:10 So here's some modern approaches. You could have exclusive psalmody. So I'm sure you still do that Psalm dominant worship with hymns or balance psalms with hymns and spiritual songs. Call this one the Colossians 3 approach. That's great. Yeah, 'cause that's the one that gets me. It's like all these things are in that passage and that correlating passage in Ephesians 2, so. So do we need to sit down and top of the worship leaders and really restrict the songs that we sing? I think I think it's AI think the overarching question is a good question to ask yourself when you're in worship. Are these songs faithful to scripture or are they not? And hopefully that that's apparent, you know, and if and if you don't think they are, I think that's a great question. Like in in charity to be like, Hey, what about maybe they can show you actually this is what it's based out of, or maybe they'll be like, man, you got me, or like, I didn't think about that.

31:07 I'm sure you know, worst case for most places, it just like, oh, we just picked a song. If it's like, you know, as popular I heard on the radio like that, you know, didn't give as much thought. Most, most churches are not. Like I'm just trying to sneak in some heresy one song at a time. Well, talking about sneaking in, I think I'm going to encourage Chris or Tim to sing above all at some point in time and honestly? To me, one of the what our church did well with reckless love is I think Tim took like 2 minutes and like explained stuff about it and even just like, and we do this often like you'll everyone will talk in between songs and like either explain something about the song or maybe a text. That kind of stuff is helpful as it right here's. Your mind, if you think about this, if you're struggling. And then we also tried replacing the word and it seemed a little weird since it's the title.

31:58 Like we do rewrite some words sometimes like we saying Jesus is better. That's our closing song. And there is a phrase that says in all triumphs Jesus is better. I think it's something like that or in all victories Jesus is better. But we rewrite that to say in all temptation because it seems like it's, yeah, there's nothing wrong with what the original 1, but it's like that one kind of really puts like in your temptations. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You need to be thinking Jesus better. So I'm not against making some little tweaks to the lyrics every now and then, but it's tough to do that to the title of the song. That's a tough one. Well, I I think that's a great way. Great place to land the plane.

32:41 Came across this quote. I love it. The Psalms teach us how to sing, but Christ teaches us why we sing. How how long does? Incorporating Christ back into it, think about what your church's songs during worship reveal what you believe about God and and what he wants from his people in worship. We got one more worship ish pod. Maybe like a survey, I guess was a subsection of time. Maybe a survey across, you know, everything starting with the early church, like what was there, you know, worship like. Yeah, that'd be good. So that's next Thursday. Next Thursday will drop. All right. So in this one we kind of talked about what exclusive psalmody, not community was.

33:24 That's right, that's right. I tried to lose off track early on. We talked about it getting really adopted out of the Reformation, John Calvin and those following around 15 hundreds for the next 100 years or so. Isaac Watts kind of in the middle of this going this is great, but where's Christ? That's right. And so we talked about some pros and cons. Who practices Exclusive? Psalmody today. Yeah, some of the, yeah, theological logic. And then, you know, ask, ask yourself when you're singing, like where you know, how, how is our church's worship? Yeah, that's good. All right, so it's a good episode summary.

34:05 Now I feel like we do have a little bit of banter we we should talk about. I I was thinking, should we like when we transition on the back end, are we like now it's time for our final take or our last or something and like transition? To the this is our take too. That's our last Yeah, yeah, something. Like that. So anyway, get it, get it out of here. I'm I, you know, it's fine. Patriots. Let's talk about the Patriots, Michael. Patriots on to the Super Bowl. What an easy life. It's it's like the kid who just, you know, everything's handed like. I saw a post today, it was like, man, our hearts go out to those second graders and younger who who have been Patriots fans all their lives and not seen a Super Bowl.

34:48 It's time that it's, you know, it's good for them to. It's it's just amazing. I feel like it happens all the time. It just like back bow Nicks breaks his ankle. It just like all all the breaks this this season in particular, the easy schedule stuff and then we get to, you know, a quarterback who if he spiked at the whole game would have would have had a better outcome. Yeah, and people, people read off that stat as though the Patriots defense had nothing to do with contributing to that stat. I don't know if they did I, I think, I think there. Was so much pressure on him. I think. His clock was speed up. You had Milton and the Tonga and another, the other defensive tackle, they were rotating in. You can look at those plays, they were in his. Are you talking about?

35:37 Texans. Well, I'm looking at, I mean, I know CJ Show missing his top two offensive threats. So I kind of feel for him a little bit. But it's like I I talked, I told this to you, Michael. He, he threw a guy was wide open and tore this guy's ACL because he had to like contort and get back to the wild. Yeah, he. I agree with you he had a bad game, but it's not as though that happens in a vacuum, that happens in the context he. Had a bad game against the 28th best defense with the Steelers. Like he fumble at four times. Anyway, that's all. I'm not saying the Patriots deserve it, because what they do good, what they've done well is they they don't wow me, but they don't decombust, they don't self destruct. I think that was a hallmark of I, I don't know if it's something that Vrabel caught, if it's a Josh McDaniels thing, but it's a hallmark of them.

36:31 You could be like, yeah, they studied film a lot, but a hallmark of them really preparing for their opponent and trying to like take away those of that opponent's weapons while, you know, re scheming stuff, you know, 'cause they don't have the same. And you could say that's true. But I've heard like these, you know, Gronk and Edelman have this podcast. Yeah. And they've have other NFL players from other teams on there. And one of the comments that they would say is that, you know, the Patriots look different every week. So it's hard for teams to scheme against them to to scheme against them. It's. Just like I just wish they would play like one, just one like top, top 20 quarterback.

37:12 That's what I want. Maybe. I mean, if we don't get it in two weeks. You might not Sam Darnold a top, he probably has top 20 quarterback, but it's like I've really wanted Matt Stafford just to have the like, even though I know the Rams defense. Wanted Matt's effort the the Rams did not look great last. Night they, they had a, they had like 500 yards, maybe not quite that many, but they, they were, they were putting on the offense if they could. Their defense did not look. Great defense, looked bad. You can't catch a punch. It's just one of those things where it's like. Teams crashed out. It's like, yeah, it's like both sides of it. I feel for it. Like I feel bad for the Broncos that their whole team's like above average and they were just like in Sidham's hands is like a bummer that he like threw like 3 basketball chess passes slash 1 when he was like he threw one backwards.

37:54 Like, Oh, I hate that your season came down to like this random guy. I the Texans defense. I hate that it came down to Stroud, but by the opposite, it's like I feel bad for Stafford that like your defense just like can't get it done because I really. But I think the and then what's going to happen is the Seahawks have have a good defense. I'm just like, man, their quarterback looked pretty. He's looked pretty good. But I saved Arnold, remember last year, his playoff past is not that great outside of this year. He's like kind of known for doing the thing that I just said the Patriots don't do. He's someone he has one pick, he's gonna throw 5 picks. Like that's like classic, you know what I mean? So it's like. What do you want, Donald? Donald, Yeah.

38:35 He won 14 with the Vikings last year, right? Did you see his playoff exit though? He caught he cost. If he was so good, the Vikings would have kept him. The bikes are getting him out of here. We don't want him or you know what I mean? Like they they where he had a really good. He's a great quarterback, but he's a little bit in his head. If I got you, I think if he's in the game. He's good. Aaron Rodgers super, super four time MVP, Super Bowl champion Aaron Rodgers. But I will say this is I I need to say my vehement discuss for the Patriots, which last night I was worried. Mac Gilbert, man, he was so complimentary of the Patriots. I I couldn't handle it. But then but then he was we were at least, you know, aligned for some of this, this catch stuff. But This is why it's really I like the Patriots fans that I know in Charleston overall.

39:25 Yeah, most of your family, there's only one person I really dislike. I'll let you guys figure that. No, I'm just kidding. All of you guys are great. But it's like, I think all the Patriots fan I knew middle school, high school, like the worst really more than this. I don't fly a lot, but I I. Probably I'm scared of the Boston Pat fans. I I that's what your daughter said yesterday. I I fly maybe like 15 * a year a couple times for like vacation and a little bit for work and it is 2 fan bases, Pat's being one of them that always are like the worst to like ever. Not to like me, but to like the stewardess and stuff like the worst. Can you guess what the other fan like when I see a hat? You could probably guess if they would.

40:05 They're kind of known for this a little bit. The Bills. No, not the Bills. But they are, they're kind of, oh, the, the Eagles. Eagles. Eagles. It's usually a Philly or a Pat's hat that I see and they're just being the worst. But Philly I kind of expected, but I guess I should but but so that's what I'm that's what I judge it off of too. But it's like, man. Hopefully we're aging out some of those older, obnoxious Boston Pats fans, you know, you know, just, I heard some of the players talking about the home games in the playoffs and how great the fans were because, you know, fans aren't always nice to their own players. And they're like, you know, just how much that support meant to them.

40:47 So, you know, maybe I. Don't know, maybe there's hope. Yeah. I don't like total. I just, I think it just ingrained in me where in my mind it's like the Pats, Ohio State, Duke, just pro. I just feel like programs that just get everything handed to them in my mind. That's my. That's my. That's my, that's what I feel. Yeah, Yeah. Where it's like, man, another lucky break. Yeah, it would have been nice to know how we would have matched up with Bonex there. It would have been nice to know, you know, what it would look like if our schedule is different. But in the words of Kanye West, I guess we'll never know. We'll never know, honestly. And it's like this too, Bo Nicks, like didn't even like break his ankle during the game.

41:27 Like, it it just like, I mean, yeah, but he finished the game, is what he said. But it's like he can finish the game, but as soon as the game's over, he's like, sorry, we're you. Could see him limping in the plays after it and he he. Could play though. Like, they think the adrenaline was probably help, but you could see him visibly grimacing on the sidelines. So it's like, yeah. 'Cause it was like, man, Stidham was just an abomination. He had one good throw and then other than that and that one throw was a really good. Throw it was he was a really good throw that that that drive. He had that one really good throw and then he had a good throw where this guy covered over the top of our DBS and was in the back of the end zone and caught it. Those were both good. Throws I I don't know a lot about football, but when my quarterback starts passing it like that, I'm out. I'm out.

42:12 Like I can understand like a little flip, like a shovel pass, but when? That's what he's trying to. Do do you want a 2? Just like no no. Let's talk about the refs blowing a whistle on that and how often are they coached. If something like that goes happen, that goes down and starts happening, you let it play out. That's true. And they did they the refs overall have done good at letting it play out. There was unusual that they did in this game, but they got they they did own it in the fact that OK, that's like us, let's make it right. They did cause a lot of times. Well, to be clear, yeah, the New York refs owned it and fixed it. They're on the same. Team the white hat on the field did not and I think if if what I saw is correct, last night was the first time the Broncos lost a home game with that white hat being the white hat there and he was the one blowing the whistle to blow that dead, which should have resulted in immediate touchdown.

43:08 Now we did get a touchdown out of. It like it always does, it works out for the Pats anyway. They even when they don't get the call, they get it. It works out for them. It's fine. We'll see. We'll see. I if as a Pats fan, would you have rather like, who did you want to see Rams or Seahawks like or do you like? It doesn't matter. You're like it. Didn't really matter until I started seeing the Rams kind of fall apart and I'm like, well, I don't like to play the Rams. I I mean I. Want us to win? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, there's no Tell me there's not a team in there that that doesn't say I want a Super Bowl victory. Who's the team? Who's the person that's like, you know, I'd want us to go up against the best, the best The Who has all their healthy players and we don't have all of our healthy players.

43:53 You want the win? You want the dub? So I was like some. People. But I thought it also would have been poetic for Stafford and May to go against each other because they've been the subject of the MVP of the league, so that would have been nice. Yeah, that'd been a cool way to end it. We'll never know. I just, I was like, this would be fun. I know we're running along here. What would be fun? But it's at the end, so it's like you could already turn it off that's. Right, That's right. We don't feel bad if we can think of it. It would be fun to do like a wager of like, oh, if the packs win, I'll do something stupid or you know what I mean? Like something like silly on the podcast. We could think of it. I was like trying to think of something that wasn't too bad, but it's like funny. Yeah, yeah, like that's like I'd be like, and it's all good fun. Like it'll, it'll be fun.

44:37 Like I would, I'd be like as a you know, it'd be, it'd be fun to do something if it's like, you know, worth it. So maybe maybe be thinking about it. We'll, we'll when, when does this air? Before Thursday, the what is the day is Monday the 26th, so this Thursday so 27th and. 29th OK, yeah. So definitely All right, cool. Well, any, any other thoughts? Get it out now. This is your chance man. Because we're not going to talk about the press until the Super Bowl, right? No, I mean. What a tough schedule. What a tough. Life. You have to. I just. I just have to. Yeah. It was a tough schedule. This is you. You poke the bear, you get a response. I remember like, the first four or five games was like, we started getting that winning streak. Yeah.

45:24 But you have not played anyone from the NFC. The AFC is horrible. We beat the Bucks and another NFC team like, well, congratulations. Like every time we beat the team that is supposed to, you know, hand us our loss, there's excuses that are made. And that's what they are. Good excuses like the CJ Stroud implode that started before the game underneath the the Steelers. You're welcome. We can cuss their best receiver and gotten CJ Stroud's head, which is not a good sign. And then? I wish this our, you know, week 1314 team could go back and play that Raiders game again. Man, it'd be a different game.

46:04 Oh. I just got an announcement Sam Darnold got in a snowmobiling accident. He's out for just give you guys the trophy. I might as well. You know what? What surprised me? You believed it for 1/2 a second. No, I'm just kidding. So we'll see. We'll see what happens. We're Super Bowls in San Francisco, something like that. I think so, yes. Yes, Yes, it is. Yeah. Sweet. All right, Yeah. Last chance. Get it out, Michael. As we're closing this episode, let's because we can't say we're about to take it next to the level that's right. We have to. That's our take. And that's take a look. It's been your you've been able to some of the patriots. You close this out all. Right. Go drink many. That's our take.

46:45 Thanks for listening to Take Two. Find us wherever you find podcasts and on YouTube for those who want to watch our video cast.