Can We Trust the New Testament?

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Well, I was thinking, Michael,
if this podcast thing doesn't

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work out for us, I mean, we
committed to it a little bit.

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I was thinking like, what's a
good backup plan?

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How can we, I'm gonna see if I
can find here we go my notes for

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this.
What what's a good backup plan

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that we could do?
And I thought is this?

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For fun or for industry?
For fun.

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I don't know what the audience
is, but maybe there is.

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This is a.
It's a little bit of a weird

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idea.
No, I would expect nothing less.

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Yeah, you're like, what else is
this?

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That's what we've been doing.
For the last couple weeks, this

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is the this is the guy who's
like, hey, let's take one claw

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off a lobster, throw it back,
sell that claw to eat, and then

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let it grow another claw.
I stand by.

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I stand by that idea.
I was thinking you guys go out

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to eat on Sundays a lot.
We do.

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I think we should.
We should review restaurants put

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with a theological bent.
OK, so I I'll give an example.

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We can workshop this like like
I, I got this idea from a

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podcast that I will listen to.
Sometimes this guy or he writes

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columns or he'll do stuff where
he will talk about sports

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players, but he will do it like
with different categories.

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And I was like, maybe we could
talk, for example, a couple

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weeks ago went to Moe's.
So and I know you're familiar

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with most.
I thought we could we could Moe

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welcome.
Yeah.

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So so some categories if we talk
about the hospitality, this

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exactly what I'm talking about.
The the fellowship factor is is

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what I was, you know, you look
at a restaurant is is it X242?

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Is it like this communal, like
we love each other, you know, or

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is it like the diaspora?
Is it like First Peter where the

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12 tribes are scattered?
It's tough out there.

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Like this is what the people
want and welcome to Moses.

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Great.
It is great and their tables

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they will easily slide together,
yes.

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So if you have a large party,
which we have had like I've been

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there once, the Mots and the
Petters and I think maybe Trey

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and Kelly Hawks family.
They're not easy to accommodate

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all those kids and families.
Yeah.

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But but Moe's did.
But Moe's does.

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That's right.
So it's so and I was thinking

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you're thinking, you know, maybe
each of us think of a restaurant

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and we could like have pre
thought biblical puns ready and

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the other person can chime in
too.

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But I think we're on the same
wavelength here.

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Other categories.
I was thinking, I was thinking

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of Paul and you know, is this is
this restaurant orderly or is it

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chaotic like you know, and not
saying one's not.

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Gonna be talking about like meat
sacrifice to idols with Paul.

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Now there's this restaurant.
Where do they get their?

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Where do they get their proteins
from?

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We could go in a, in a, in a lot
of directions.

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I, I had a category about
hospitality.

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Thinking of it is the
hospitality of Abraham, you

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know, like right there or is it
not there?

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Moe's fits that bill.
Speaking of, can I?

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Can I help you?
Yeah, please do.

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I have.
Noticed maybe the past six

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months, everyone at a restaurant
says welcome in versus versus

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welcome or welcome to Moe's or
welcome to Texas Roadhouse or

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it's like welcome in.
And that's just like a new, it's

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a new phraseology for me, but
man.

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Yeah, I'll, I'll, I'll pay
attention to that.

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That might be like a little sub,
a subsection portion size.

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Is this a loaves and fishes
situation that can feed everyone

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or is this like the mana in the
wilderness where you're trying

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to hoard it off for yourself
'cause you're a little bit

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worried?
Moe's man.

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It's it's there's enough for
everyone.

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That's.
With all those chips, they just.

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Like and then the chips.
Yeah, that's exactly right.

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It's like.
Chips in the salsa bar I I have

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gone to slow Moe's long enough
to remember when they had really

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good names and they also had all
of these look alikes.

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Do you remember that Where you?
I remember the name like names I

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think.
So the names of the salsa, like

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they had one that was Kaiser
salsa.

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Something.
And I'm going to forget them

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now, but they had, they had some
cool names for the sauces, but

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then they also had pictures of
like people like a guy who won

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the Michael Jackson look alike
contest or stuff like that.

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So they had all these, it looked
like, and they would say

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something good about Moe's and
they would actually tribute to

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the right.
But it looked like, you know,

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Michael Jackson was endorsing
Moe's.

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So I, I don't, I don't know if
they got sued for that, but

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yeah.
That's great.

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Another category it could be if
you're a sit down rush or not,

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you know, was your cup
overflowing?

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How were the what was the
refill?

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What was the drink situation?
Moe's again has the machine that

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has like 800 different options.
Yeah.

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Did they prepare a table for you
in the presence of your?

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Enemies.
That's right.

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That's fine.
Yeah, I love it, The Salm test.

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But animals refills my truck, my
cup.

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My cup truly did overflow.
It was great.

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Here's one I I came across.
I thought this was pretty funny.

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The sermon length test.
Fortunately, Moe's comes quicker

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than a seeker sensitive sermon.
In 10 minutes, you're getting

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your stuff.
It's not a Puritan John

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MacArthur servant where you're
waiting for an hour.

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You know there aren't.
Yeah, there are some of those,

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yeah.
And then there's another

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category.
I was thinking, you know, is

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this place tide worthy?
You know, are you gonna, are you

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gonna tip 10% or more?
You know, is this, you know, do

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you feel like they, they, you
know, it's one of the places

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that, that.
So anyway, we don't use these

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categories.
We can come up with different

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ones, but I think there there's
a little bit here we can like

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rate restaurants, you know?
Yeah.

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Is it, you know, maybe.
Is it so bad you're looking

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forward to the second coming
better?

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There you go.
The more puns the better.

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And then and then like our final
verdict to wrap it up, I'll be

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like 1 to MO's.
Give it 4 out of five solos.

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Like, you know, give it that.
Yeah, pretty good, Yeah.

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Yeah, 4:00 to 5:00.
And I was like, you go, you guys

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go at least, you know, every
Sunday we go out of, I think

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between the two of us, we can
like figure out some, you know,

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and I was like, podcast isn't
working out.

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We can cut these aside and just
be like, here's our Moe's

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review, you know, see if we get
some.

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Stragglers Yeah, I left a review
for some restaurant and I guess

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my and because we thought it was
so good.

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Oh yeah.
And Chloe was like, we're I'm

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going to leave one too.
And she saw mine show up and

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then she clicked on and she read
all my and then I don't guess my

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family knew, but I'm like, I
guess I'm pretty.

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I mean, I'm sure there's more up
there like, but I'm higher.

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Than your oh because you rate a
lot of stuff I.

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Rate stuff and people find it
good and they're laughing at

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some of the things I said.
They're like, there's all these

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pictures of our family at places
and I thought you were more And

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I'm like, well, I if someone
wants to find out pictures of

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our family, I think.
They can figure it out.

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They can figure it out, Yeah.
So what was the good place you

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went to?
I'm gonna forget that.

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Man, that's what the listeners
want, the hotspot.

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You're keeping it all to
yourself, so.

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So keep the traffic down so you
can have them.

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I'm old, Zach.
I'm old.

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Though that's fine, I'll.
I can look it up and then maybe

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get back to you.
It's great.

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So anyway, Moe's, great
experience, great, very

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welcoming, large portion sizes,
the salsa bar, great drinks,

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whatever you want.
You know, how can you go?

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How can you go?
Rum.

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Yeah, I don't think I don't.
I don't love paying like 20

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bucks for a burrito but
everywhere you're going to pay

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money and you get a cheaper 20.
Bucks but it seems like prices

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were maybe creeping up a little
bit pre COVID, but it's like

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post COVID it's like the price
exploded.

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It's yeah, you go.
So you're like, I that was OK,

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very expensive.
Yeah, yeah.

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I, I, Phoebe found a nickel on
the street.

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She was like, I want to buy some
candy.

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I was like, I remember.
I don't know if, like, I

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remember at our local grocer,
there would just be a box of

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individual jog ranchers, like 2
for a nickel and you could just

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give them a nickel and get like,
maybe it was 3 for a nickel.

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I don't know.
It was like incredibly cheap.

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And I sound like I, I know I
sound like the, you know, the

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like I remember we used to build
a movie and get popcorn for, you

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know, $0.50 type of thing.
But yeah, so those days are

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gone.
Those days are gone that I mean,

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we have to factor that into some
of these categories.

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You know, some of these places
we gotta we'll come up with

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some.
So if if you're listening, you

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have a good category like I'd
like to, we could even I would

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like to get it to where it's
like a well oiled machine.

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We like 3 to 4 go twos.
Maybe we sprinkle on like some

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bonus ones based on it, but it's
like give some consistency and

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we're not here just to say every
restaurant's great, every

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restaurant's not great.
We're we'll speak the truth.

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In the North.
But we'll speak the truth.

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We love you.
We're pointing these things out

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so you can get.
Better.

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Yeah, that's.
Good, that's so.

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Anyway, that, that was my idea.
I'm I'm hoping maybe like a once

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a month thing we can, you know,
roll this out, you know, so

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there you go.
All right, what?

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So what are We'll preview a
little bit.

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Oh, responding yeah to comments.
I'm excited for these.

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These are so good.
Yeah, we had one and it got a

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lot of traction.
And I think there's more to come

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back to on that one.
Agreed.

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But you know, we'll let the
moral argument settle for a

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little bit.
Yeah, we.

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The only thing we didn't want to
say is like Michael said, I

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think we want to come back to
it.

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So we're not like skipping it
with this.

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We just want to do IT service
and we had this kind of already

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planned, you know, we you know
what I mean.

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'Cause if you listen to that
one, our response, one, we're

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like, we're going to respond to
two different ones and the other

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one took too long.
And so we're like, OK, we'll

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just cut it off here.
But well, and there have been a

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lot of I think 5960 comments,
which is pretty I it's not Mr.

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Beast, you know, so that's
amazing.

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More than one comment is great
and 50s and.

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You know, I was gonna say
there's just one guy.

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I just don't know if I
understand.

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I don't know if I'm on the same
page as this.

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Reform Form D.
He's yeah, he's little SUS.

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No, I honestly overall great
dialogue and reform and

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specifically I know that's is it
OK to connect names that bad?

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He used to have his name and
then he changed it.

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So maybe, maybe he wants to say,
Incognito, we know who you are.

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We know who you are, and I
would.

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Appreciate you.
Really appreciate you very smart

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and like not like.
Well, he's in the medical field.

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So not yeah of.
Course.

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But not only smart but good
dialogue where I honestly

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reading through it was like he
is assuming the best in this

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person.
He's being very charitable and

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being patient even when it was
it maybe patience wasn't it.

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I was like, it was great
dialogue honestly all around.

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Yeah, I thought so.
And I've seen some comment

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sections go really bad, throwing
out ad homonyms and stuff like

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that.
And even for the people who

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disagree with us, we appreciate
the dialogue being at a high

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level where you're dealing with,
you know, facts and stuff.

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Even when you disagree sharply,
you can do it in a way that is

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polite.
So we appreciate that.

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I'm also thinking about getting
on there and just being like

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naming in a Boo Boo, like like
taking it down a notch because

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it was so smart and so good, but
it was great.

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So this this is Part 2 of that
original 1 taking on a comment.

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Let's go ahead and take it to
the next level from the hearts

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00:10:30,600 --> 00:10:32,920
of the low country in South
Carolina.

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It's the Take Two podcast where
we take theology to the next

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level.
All right, so we have a comment

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00:10:40,800 --> 00:10:42,640
from.
A great name.

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00:10:42,840 --> 00:10:45,240
Great name, yeah.
Is it it it with the comment was

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from?
Is this 13 shadow?

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Wolf 13.
Shadow.

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Wolf, I love the name.
I love like YouTube names and

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00:10:50,400 --> 00:10:52,640
handles.
Shadow Wolf is a cool name.

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00:10:53,280 --> 00:10:55,360
Whenever I'm going to make
names, I like never know what to

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make.
I just made like a Kobe 1.

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Like I was like Kobe forever or
something, you know?

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And you do show up here.
Kobe.

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00:11:00,960 --> 00:11:03,000
Kobe forever.
Oh yeah, and that was taken to

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Kobe Forever 824.
What's 824 are?

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00:11:05,960 --> 00:11:08,000
You serious?
OK, OK, OK.

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I was about to get riled up, but
but but this, this is great.

250
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I love, love the interaction
here.

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00:11:16,080 --> 00:11:17,280
What?
What's the first comment?

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00:11:17,280 --> 00:11:21,080
Oh yeah, so shadow Wolf 13
Shadow Wolf says the fact that

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modern people still believe in
ancient mythology is truly

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disappointing to witness.
The people that wrote the Bible

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00:11:27,600 --> 00:11:30,880
have absolutely no idea what
they were talking about.

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00:11:31,200 --> 00:11:34,880
And I appreciate this comment
because I think a lot a lot of

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00:11:34,880 --> 00:11:37,880
people are OK Bible written a
long time ago.

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00:11:38,280 --> 00:11:42,480
Why is it different than
everything else from that time

259
00:11:42,480 --> 00:11:43,600
frame?
We kind of like dismiss that

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00:11:43,600 --> 00:11:46,480
ever progressivism like we're
better today than we were 50

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00:11:46,480 --> 00:11:49,520
years ago.
That's like common thinking I I

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00:11:49,520 --> 00:11:51,960
believe, right?
I think it can go in cycles

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00:11:51,960 --> 00:11:55,600
because most, you know, you
know, the Bible was written

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00:11:55,600 --> 00:12:00,160
across, started being written
around 1500 BC, completed around

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00:12:00,160 --> 00:12:04,360
100 AD.
And so there's actually a lot of

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00:12:04,360 --> 00:12:06,800
stuff written along during that
time.

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00:12:06,800 --> 00:12:08,920
That's right.
You have Plato writing for

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Socrates and himself Aristotle
writing.

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00:12:11,240 --> 00:12:14,040
Plato, Aristotle, like people go
back to them frequently.

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00:12:14,400 --> 00:12:17,720
Homer, the Iliad, you know, so
there are some great works that

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00:12:17,720 --> 00:12:19,880
people would look back and go,
oh, these were some smart

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00:12:19,880 --> 00:12:21,960
people.
So you wouldn't want to fall in

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00:12:21,960 --> 00:12:24,360
the trap that just cause it's a
long time ago that you know

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00:12:24,400 --> 00:12:26,560
these are.
Cause 'cause I I but I like that

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you explain that because I think
a lot of people just like

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00:12:29,440 --> 00:12:30,760
default think that.
Yeah.

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00:12:31,240 --> 00:12:35,520
And, and they, they just think
naturally, oh, you know, 100

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00:12:35,520 --> 00:12:38,640
years ago we have better medical
procedures or, you know, people

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00:12:38,640 --> 00:12:40,760
don't get like we have
antibiotics.

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00:12:40,760 --> 00:12:43,080
And if you go back 200 years
ago, people were dying from

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00:12:43,080 --> 00:12:45,680
like, you know, scarlet fever
or, I don't know, It's like

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00:12:45,720 --> 00:12:47,480
you're like, of course we're
better, you know what I mean?

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00:12:47,480 --> 00:12:50,240
And I feel like there are
definitely different measures

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where we are better, but by some
measures we're not as good.

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00:12:55,000 --> 00:12:56,680
I think we probably always trade
stuff off.

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00:12:56,680 --> 00:13:00,440
Like I heard one person going
off on probably how dumb the

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00:13:00,440 --> 00:13:04,400
founding fathers were.
And I'm like these people, like,

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00:13:05,080 --> 00:13:08,880
spoke multiple languages.
Like, yeah, could translate

289
00:13:08,880 --> 00:13:12,400
like, they had a very rigorous,
like, classical scholastic

290
00:13:12,400 --> 00:13:15,520
training.
And so, you know, could quote

291
00:13:15,520 --> 00:13:18,200
like long passages of books and
stuff.

292
00:13:18,200 --> 00:13:22,200
So they were very learned.
I I was just reading this guy

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00:13:22,200 --> 00:13:25,480
John Gill.
He's like a Reformed Baptist

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00:13:25,640 --> 00:13:27,480
pastor from like the 1600
Puritans.

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00:13:28,000 --> 00:13:30,200
And like, I was reading like I
was getting a quote for a Sunday

296
00:13:30,200 --> 00:13:33,440
school I'm looking at.
And like he like learned, he

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00:13:33,440 --> 00:13:36,800
like learned Greek and Hebrew
when he was like 9 or he learned

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00:13:36,840 --> 00:13:39,000
Latin when he was 9 and Greek
and Hebrew and he was like 12.

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00:13:39,000 --> 00:13:41,160
And it was like, this was like
he, he was like maybe an

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00:13:41,160 --> 00:13:43,720
outlier, but not really.
Like a lot of people did this.

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00:13:44,040 --> 00:13:46,240
Was it?
Was it John Quincy Adams that

302
00:13:46,240 --> 00:13:48,560
could like write in two
different languages with both

303
00:13:48,560 --> 00:13:51,800
his hands at the same time?
What what surprised me, it's

304
00:13:51,800 --> 00:13:53,800
like they knew all this stuff
and we have more access

305
00:13:53,800 --> 00:13:56,480
information, but we don't know
things and you have to.

306
00:13:56,480 --> 00:13:58,800
We can find it maybe, but we
can't.

307
00:13:59,040 --> 00:14:00,520
We definitely don't know this
stuff.

308
00:14:00,560 --> 00:14:02,720
Cold, right?
Yeah, I think that is the case.

309
00:14:03,240 --> 00:14:04,560
So there was some back and
forth.

310
00:14:04,560 --> 00:14:09,680
You asked some questions like,
hey, could you explain that a

311
00:14:09,680 --> 00:14:12,040
little bit more?
What do you mean by mythology?

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00:14:12,040 --> 00:14:17,280
I think I chimed in a little bit
and asked, you know, basically

313
00:14:17,280 --> 00:14:21,640
recommended looking more closely
at this, this idea that Jesus is

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00:14:21,640 --> 00:14:24,840
based off mythologies.
There's a little bit of back and

315
00:14:24,840 --> 00:14:26,640
forth.
And again, it was all, you know,

316
00:14:26,640 --> 00:14:28,560
even though we disagreed, I
thought it was all good.

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00:14:28,960 --> 00:14:34,160
So I thought maybe we could talk
about the Bible itself and maybe

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00:14:34,160 --> 00:14:38,360
why it is likely more
trustworthy than what you might

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00:14:38,440 --> 00:14:42,840
think.
And so have we.

320
00:14:43,000 --> 00:14:45,400
Have we already?
We've done a textual criticism

321
00:14:45,400 --> 00:14:47,680
one, but I think this is good
and I don't know if we took this

322
00:14:47,680 --> 00:14:51,240
exact example or approach.
I think this is great to re talk

323
00:14:51,240 --> 00:14:51,960
about.
Yeah.

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00:14:51,960 --> 00:14:57,000
So just a New Testament in
itself, there are around 138, a

325
00:14:57,000 --> 00:15:03,760
136,000 words in there, and we
have 6000 original Greek

326
00:15:03,760 --> 00:15:05,960
manuscripts.
And that's for every book.

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00:15:05,960 --> 00:15:09,680
Some books have more than others
and there's 27 different books

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00:15:09,680 --> 00:15:12,600
there.
And then on top of that, we have

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00:15:12,600 --> 00:15:19,640
like 14,000 other manuscripts in
different languages like Coptic,

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00:15:19,640 --> 00:15:25,800
Syriac, some Latin stuff.
So there's a lot of even outside

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00:15:25,800 --> 00:15:28,680
the original language that
scholars can use to like, well,

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00:15:28,680 --> 00:15:31,560
what did they think that meant
in that language to help them

333
00:15:31,560 --> 00:15:34,160
get back at?
The results on top of it, I

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00:15:34,440 --> 00:15:36,240
think we talked about a little
bit of this claim, but you read

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00:15:36,240 --> 00:15:40,680
like even the, not the, not the
founding fathers of the church

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00:15:40,680 --> 00:15:43,320
fathers, church fathers.
And you can like maybe not put

337
00:15:43,320 --> 00:15:44,920
together the whole thing, but
you can, you can extrapolate

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00:15:44,920 --> 00:15:48,040
large passages based on, based
on there's, that's not a, that's

339
00:15:48,040 --> 00:15:49,920
not a manuscript, but like just
from the right.

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00:15:49,920 --> 00:15:52,040
And you can be like, oh, they're
quoting this passage.

341
00:15:52,040 --> 00:15:54,080
Right now, yeah, Yeah.
So, yeah, there are large

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00:15:54,080 --> 00:15:56,000
sections of the New Testament
quoted in their works.

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00:15:56,000 --> 00:15:58,640
OK.
But when you the The thing is,

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00:15:58,640 --> 00:16:02,440
we have so many manuscripts in
there and this is from here on

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00:16:02,440 --> 00:16:04,880
out, it's all original Greek is
what I'm talking about.

346
00:16:05,240 --> 00:16:08,280
There are around 400,000
variants that.

347
00:16:08,280 --> 00:16:11,200
Sounds bad.
Why are there so many bearings?

348
00:16:11,200 --> 00:16:12,320
This is bad.
It's what it seems.

349
00:16:12,360 --> 00:16:15,360
Like it does seem bad, but you
can start like knocking away

350
00:16:15,360 --> 00:16:19,040
those 380 thousand of those
approximately.

351
00:16:19,040 --> 00:16:23,800
These are broad strokes are
spelling changes or word order

352
00:16:23,800 --> 00:16:25,320
like.
Jesus Christ versus Christ

353
00:16:25,360 --> 00:16:26,120
Jesus.
Right.

354
00:16:26,120 --> 00:16:29,800
Or in some sometimes you would
put a an article in front of

355
00:16:29,800 --> 00:16:33,400
someone's name.
So James or the James or you

356
00:16:33,400 --> 00:16:35,200
just would spell someone's name
slightly.

357
00:16:35,400 --> 00:16:37,640
Yeah, 'cause where they're
spelling standards like we have

358
00:16:37,640 --> 00:16:38,440
today.
No.

359
00:16:38,640 --> 00:16:41,520
So it's like you like with like
big words you might like, it's

360
00:16:41,720 --> 00:16:44,000
acceptable to, I mean, whatever.
Yeah, right.

361
00:16:44,320 --> 00:16:47,120
So when we're counting those,
almost all of them go

362
00:16:47,120 --> 00:16:50,760
immediately away to like, you
don't even need like as long as

363
00:16:50,760 --> 00:16:53,400
you could read.
Yeah, you wouldn't figure that

364
00:16:53,400 --> 00:16:56,280
out.
Then that leaves around 20,000

365
00:16:56,280 --> 00:17:00,360
variants and 19,000 of those are
what we would call dead on

366
00:17:00,360 --> 00:17:02,080
arrival.
You don't need any training

367
00:17:02,440 --> 00:17:05,560
because like lots of times we'll
see there's actually names for

368
00:17:05,560 --> 00:17:08,800
this, like where a scribe will
write a line twice or he'll skip

369
00:17:08,800 --> 00:17:12,040
a line, or this is a singular
reading.

370
00:17:12,040 --> 00:17:14,760
There's no other manuscript that
has these 5.

371
00:17:14,760 --> 00:17:17,000
Paragraphs there point outlier
like you could you could have

372
00:17:17,000 --> 00:17:21,720
added a letter and totally
changed the word and it's like,

373
00:17:21,760 --> 00:17:25,319
oh, that you didn't mean sharks,
he meant he was happy or

374
00:17:25,319 --> 00:17:26,920
something.
And you're like, OK, we can get

375
00:17:26,920 --> 00:17:30,760
rid of that.
So that gets us down to 1000

376
00:17:30,760 --> 00:17:35,920
variants where you need training
to figure out which one is the

377
00:17:35,920 --> 00:17:38,960
case.
And of those 1000 variants,

378
00:17:39,000 --> 00:17:42,280
roughly 950 of them are very
easy to solve.

379
00:17:42,560 --> 00:17:46,840
All of the textual critics who
have training, they basically

380
00:17:46,840 --> 00:17:51,280
agree on 950 of these.
And so it gets down to around 50

381
00:17:51,360 --> 00:17:54,000
variants where it's tough to
solve.

382
00:17:54,360 --> 00:17:58,120
And different people will have
different opinions on it.

383
00:17:58,120 --> 00:18:00,800
They'll say, I think it's this
because of these things.

384
00:18:00,800 --> 00:18:03,680
And they'll write, you know,
this academic paper putting

385
00:18:03,680 --> 00:18:06,160
forth why they think that
variant should be read this way.

386
00:18:06,440 --> 00:18:08,200
And someone will say, no, I
disagree.

387
00:18:08,560 --> 00:18:10,920
And I think the original text
said X.

388
00:18:10,920 --> 00:18:14,120
And there's around 50 of these.
And so and so you say 50.

389
00:18:14,120 --> 00:18:17,280
It's not that many committed to
400,000, but this is the Bible

390
00:18:17,280 --> 00:18:19,520
you're talking about.
You know, what if one of the

391
00:18:19,520 --> 00:18:24,360
words was, you know, work save
you or they don't say this seems

392
00:18:24,360 --> 00:18:27,360
like a pretty big, you know,
could be have big implications.

393
00:18:27,480 --> 00:18:29,120
Right.
Well, none of those fifty are in

394
00:18:29,120 --> 00:18:32,560
places where that's the kind of
thing that's on the line.

395
00:18:32,640 --> 00:18:37,440
And so one of them that I like
to use because it's is one that

396
00:18:37,440 --> 00:18:39,560
gets a lot of play back and
forth.

397
00:18:39,560 --> 00:18:43,400
Mark 141.
We don't know for sure whether

398
00:18:43,400 --> 00:18:46,880
the word is originally
compassion or anger, so you

399
00:18:46,880 --> 00:18:49,440
could read it.
It's translated in in ESP as

400
00:18:49,440 --> 00:18:51,400
compassion, mood with
compassion.

401
00:18:51,920 --> 00:18:55,000
Jesus reached out with his hand
and touched him and said to him,

402
00:18:55,000 --> 00:18:59,040
I am willing be cleansed.
Well, there are some manuscripts

403
00:18:59,040 --> 00:19:02,960
that have mood with anger that
doesn't really make sense to us.

404
00:19:04,360 --> 00:19:07,560
But actually the more difficult
reading, sometimes people like

405
00:19:07,680 --> 00:19:11,440
to adopt because they would say,
well, you would never change

406
00:19:11,440 --> 00:19:13,560
compassion to anger, but you
might change anger to.

407
00:19:13,560 --> 00:19:17,440
Compassion.
Let me like make it a little bit

408
00:19:17,440 --> 00:19:20,480
softer.
And so depending on which one of

409
00:19:20,480 --> 00:19:23,840
those words is true, it might
help color the story.

410
00:19:23,840 --> 00:19:28,400
But it both of the stories have
Jesus performing the miracle and

411
00:19:28,400 --> 00:19:30,960
healing someone.
Yeah, it doesn't change the end

412
00:19:30,960 --> 00:19:32,840
result.
And, and honestly, I, I like

413
00:19:32,840 --> 00:19:35,400
that you bring up that example
'cause that's probably like the

414
00:19:35,440 --> 00:19:38,480
quote UN quote worst one where
there there's a difference

415
00:19:38,480 --> 00:19:40,680
between compassion and anger.
It does change some things, but

416
00:19:40,680 --> 00:19:43,680
it doesn't change right very
much.

417
00:19:43,920 --> 00:19:47,440
A lot of the other ones as we
look at are a lot more subtle,

418
00:19:47,560 --> 00:19:50,120
even if they are significant.
Like they actually change the

419
00:19:50,120 --> 00:19:53,000
meaning, but not really.
Like it is a different.

420
00:19:53,000 --> 00:19:55,040
Word, I think we have, I don't
know, several of them here.

421
00:19:55,040 --> 00:19:56,400
We don't have to go through
necessary all of them.

422
00:19:56,400 --> 00:20:01,880
Another one, Romans 51, we have
peace versus let us have peace.

423
00:20:02,520 --> 00:20:06,400
Therefore, having been justified
by faith, we have peace with God

424
00:20:06,400 --> 00:20:10,080
through our Lord Jesus Christ is
how NASB some will argue,

425
00:20:10,080 --> 00:20:13,840
because in some manuscripts it
says let us have peace with God

426
00:20:13,840 --> 00:20:16,440
through our Lord Jesus Christ.
And, and that's where like a lot

427
00:20:16,440 --> 00:20:17,880
of these 50, that's what they
are.

428
00:20:18,200 --> 00:20:19,560
It's like a different way to
read.

429
00:20:19,680 --> 00:20:21,960
But essentially it's it's the,
it's the same.

430
00:20:23,200 --> 00:20:26,480
First Timothy 316, God was
manifested in the flesh versus

431
00:20:26,480 --> 00:20:30,640
who was manifested in the flesh.
So originally in the NSP it says

432
00:20:30,640 --> 00:20:34,200
by common confession, great is
the mystery of godliness he who

433
00:20:34,200 --> 00:20:36,360
was revealed or manifested in
the flesh.

434
00:20:37,680 --> 00:20:41,960
And so is it he or is it God?
So the thought is probably maybe

435
00:20:41,960 --> 00:20:45,440
someone went back and made it be
God manifested where it was

436
00:20:45,440 --> 00:20:47,600
really just a pronoun.
But those are the types of

437
00:20:47,600 --> 00:20:50,360
things that we're talking about.
Any more of these that stick

438
00:20:50,360 --> 00:20:53,440
out?
Well, the number maybe it's not

439
00:20:53,440 --> 00:20:55,160
666.
Dude.

440
00:20:55,240 --> 00:20:58,520
Could be 616.
I remember when I worked at

441
00:20:58,520 --> 00:21:02,240
McDonald's back in high school,
every now and then we'd have

442
00:21:02,280 --> 00:21:05,920
some to order or come up to 666.
They'd be like I've got.

443
00:21:06,400 --> 00:21:07,320
To take an apple.
Pie.

444
00:21:07,320 --> 00:21:10,280
Add an apple pie to it.
But maybe they should be on the

445
00:21:10,280 --> 00:21:13,040
lookout for 6/16.
You know, maybe that was it.

446
00:21:13,880 --> 00:21:17,160
So those are the level of
variance now, just because

447
00:21:19,080 --> 00:21:22,480
basically what what this is
arguing is we can get back to

448
00:21:22,720 --> 00:21:27,480
the originals of what these
people wrote with certainty

449
00:21:27,600 --> 00:21:29,960
better than any other historic
document.

450
00:21:31,120 --> 00:21:33,120
If you're going to throw out the
if you're going to say we don't

451
00:21:33,120 --> 00:21:36,600
know what they wrote for the New
Testament, then you have to

452
00:21:36,600 --> 00:21:40,080
basically throw out all of your
books from antiquity and just.

453
00:21:40,080 --> 00:21:41,920
Like.
We just don't really know.

454
00:21:41,920 --> 00:21:43,880
You have to be agnostic about
all that.

455
00:21:44,320 --> 00:21:47,360
But just because we know what
they wrote doesn't necessarily

456
00:21:47,360 --> 00:21:51,200
mean they wrote truth.
And so there are other tests

457
00:21:51,200 --> 00:21:53,680
like if you were to look at, I
don't even know if we have this

458
00:21:53,680 --> 00:21:57,640
in, in our notes, but like if
you were to look at Luke and

459
00:21:57,640 --> 00:22:02,560
what he wrote in Acts and all
the details that he got right

460
00:22:03,160 --> 00:22:07,200
and like he got stuff right that
historians for a long time

461
00:22:07,280 --> 00:22:09,680
thought was wrong.
And This is why it's yeah, yeah,

462
00:22:09,680 --> 00:22:11,600
yeah.
And then they find stuff that's

463
00:22:11,600 --> 00:22:15,240
like, Oh no, I think it was the
name Pro Council for the leaders

464
00:22:15,240 --> 00:22:16,840
in Philippine.
And they're like, this is not a

465
00:22:16,840 --> 00:22:18,800
thing we do.
I think there's something

466
00:22:18,800 --> 00:22:23,120
similar with like they're like,
oh, actually Jericho, there's no

467
00:22:23,120 --> 00:22:25,800
history of the of this place
here.

468
00:22:25,800 --> 00:22:28,600
And then it's like in the 90s
archaeology like, oh, actually

469
00:22:28,920 --> 00:22:32,800
this makes a lot of sense.
And there's like 10's and like

470
00:22:32,800 --> 00:22:35,240
there's a like more than one of
these kind of examples.

471
00:22:35,440 --> 00:22:37,480
And Luke wrote the book of Acts
and Luke.

472
00:22:37,640 --> 00:22:42,160
And so, you know, if Luke's
trustworthy in Acts, trustworthy

473
00:22:42,160 --> 00:22:46,680
in, you know, Luke and there's
it's easy for us maybe in this

474
00:22:46,680 --> 00:22:48,440
mindset today to go, oh, he
could have looked it up.

475
00:22:48,440 --> 00:22:51,480
Like you can't look in that.
You're not look in those kind of

476
00:22:51,480 --> 00:22:53,680
details.
It's easier to falsify

477
00:22:53,680 --> 00:22:55,960
something.
And the fact that you, I mean,

478
00:22:55,960 --> 00:22:59,160
you'd be like, oh, who's going
to like, you could technically

479
00:22:59,160 --> 00:23:01,360
like I'm going to write about
this thing in Africa, like who's

480
00:23:01,400 --> 00:23:04,280
going to Fact Check me on that?
And then 20 years later, people

481
00:23:04,280 --> 00:23:06,600
could Fact Check you on that.
But it seems like they're

482
00:23:06,680 --> 00:23:08,000
turning right, you know what I
mean?

483
00:23:08,120 --> 00:23:11,040
Yeah, yeah.
So Luke has been found to be

484
00:23:11,040 --> 00:23:12,960
very like the, you know,
everything.

485
00:23:12,960 --> 00:23:17,320
He he checks out John's gospel.
He doesn't have a lot of travel

486
00:23:17,320 --> 00:23:20,840
stuff in there, but he has like
a lot of stuff that's local to

487
00:23:20,840 --> 00:23:24,280
Judea.
And you know, even the stuff

488
00:23:24,280 --> 00:23:27,600
like all the descriptors of we
went up here, we went down here,

489
00:23:27,600 --> 00:23:29,840
that's not North and South,
that's normally elevation.

490
00:23:29,840 --> 00:23:34,720
So all of it reads like history.
So most New Testament

491
00:23:34,720 --> 00:23:37,360
historians, and I'm, I'm talking
about, you know, things that we

492
00:23:37,400 --> 00:23:40,880
would consider conservative and
non conservative, they treat the

493
00:23:40,880 --> 00:23:43,120
New Testament as reliable
history.

494
00:23:43,560 --> 00:23:47,280
The there's a, a large swath
that reject the miracles, right,

495
00:23:47,280 --> 00:23:48,720
'cause that doesn't fit their
worldview.

496
00:23:49,040 --> 00:23:51,880
But then they have to give a
reason why they would reject the

497
00:23:51,880 --> 00:23:53,000
miracles that they find in
there.

498
00:23:53,000 --> 00:23:58,560
But they find it to be
historically reliable, even even

499
00:23:58,560 --> 00:24:02,400
those who would put themselves
in not believing, you know, the

500
00:24:02,520 --> 00:24:04,400
the Christianity part of the
books.

501
00:24:04,400 --> 00:24:08,360
I, I will say this too, there's
no other book that's been like

502
00:24:08,760 --> 00:24:10,960
torn apart or about.
It's not like people going

503
00:24:10,960 --> 00:24:14,400
through Homer's Odyssey and like
looking for every concert, Like

504
00:24:14,840 --> 00:24:17,040
if you put that same attention
on any other book that that's

505
00:24:17,040 --> 00:24:20,920
what's impressive about it is
that's been studied for so many

506
00:24:20,920 --> 00:24:23,320
years by people of all different
walks of life.

507
00:24:23,320 --> 00:24:26,520
And it's like if you're trying
to poke holes it, it's just like

508
00:24:26,520 --> 00:24:28,440
up for it's up for grabs.
You know what I mean?

509
00:24:28,520 --> 00:24:31,080
Yeah.
And there have been one of the

510
00:24:31,080 --> 00:24:36,640
comments on the other video we
did was it basically seemed, I'm

511
00:24:36,640 --> 00:24:39,000
going to summarize, I'm not
going to quote it, but basically

512
00:24:39,000 --> 00:24:42,320
The thing is for your audience,
they already believe.

513
00:24:42,920 --> 00:24:46,160
And so what's the purpose of
apologetics?

514
00:24:47,280 --> 00:24:49,520
Because if you're not already in
the audience, you're not going

515
00:24:49,520 --> 00:24:50,760
to believe it.
And if you're already in the

516
00:24:50,760 --> 00:24:52,320
audience, then then you will
believe it.

517
00:24:52,320 --> 00:24:56,040
This was in the, this was in the
comment of the most recent 1.

518
00:24:56,360 --> 00:25:00,440
And I will say that, well, there
are Christians who have doubts,

519
00:25:00,520 --> 00:25:02,840
right?
There are people who, you know,

520
00:25:02,840 --> 00:25:05,120
maybe don't know all these facts
and they, you know, they hear

521
00:25:05,120 --> 00:25:08,040
something, they have doubts.
So it's good to, you know, give

522
00:25:08,040 --> 00:25:12,040
them some rational reasons for
their belief and for their

523
00:25:12,040 --> 00:25:14,840
faith.
But there are also been a number

524
00:25:14,840 --> 00:25:18,800
of atheists who have sought out
to poke holes in the Bible like

525
00:25:18,800 --> 00:25:21,000
you're talking and then were
converted.

526
00:25:21,000 --> 00:25:23,160
Lee Strobel famously was one of
those.

527
00:25:24,040 --> 00:25:30,400
Jay Warner Wallace was one.
There is a Muslim up in Michigan

528
00:25:30,400 --> 00:25:33,840
and I can't think of his name
right now, who basically set

529
00:25:33,840 --> 00:25:39,080
out, he's a lawyer and set out
to prove the Bible wrong and was

530
00:25:39,080 --> 00:25:42,600
converted to that process.
Nabil Qureshi, he's passed on,

531
00:25:42,600 --> 00:25:48,640
but he and Chris Wood something
would Matt Wood, Michael Wood, I

532
00:25:48,640 --> 00:25:50,840
can't remember the first name,
but they were roommates in

533
00:25:50,840 --> 00:25:55,120
college and he was missed.
I'll just call him Mr. Wood was

534
00:25:55,120 --> 00:25:59,920
a Christian, Nabil was a Muslim
and they had conversations,

535
00:25:59,920 --> 00:26:02,360
conversations and he slowly is
converted through these

536
00:26:02,360 --> 00:26:04,600
arguments.
So I'm not saying that everyone

537
00:26:04,600 --> 00:26:08,560
who hears an apologetic argument
is going to be converted, but I

538
00:26:08,560 --> 00:26:11,640
think that they are strong
enough that they are worthy to

539
00:26:11,640 --> 00:26:14,760
be considered.
What I would like and I again 13

540
00:26:14,760 --> 00:26:17,200
Shadow Wolf, thank you for this.
I'm going to read this comment

541
00:26:17,200 --> 00:26:21,160
that they said because I think
this would help us out if we

542
00:26:21,160 --> 00:26:23,800
drill like what I I liked about
the other comments section that

543
00:26:23,800 --> 00:26:25,000
we will maybe get to in the
future.

544
00:26:25,000 --> 00:26:27,280
They drilled down on some more
specifics, which was helpful.

545
00:26:27,640 --> 00:26:29,600
He says.
I used to work in a library

546
00:26:29,600 --> 00:26:31,120
archive.
I got to look at some of the

547
00:26:31,120 --> 00:26:33,640
Dead Sea Scrolls and non
canonical gospel manuscripts.

548
00:26:33,640 --> 00:26:35,360
I've spoken directly with
curators, linguists, and

549
00:26:35,360 --> 00:26:38,280
historical experts.
The modern Bible is extremely

550
00:26:38,280 --> 00:26:40,520
different than the original
text, and the fact that there

551
00:26:40,520 --> 00:26:42,880
isn't an actual method of
determining which gospels are

552
00:26:42,880 --> 00:26:46,600
Canon other than tradition is a
strong indication that modern

553
00:26:46,600 --> 00:26:48,920
Christian beliefs are just
another retelling of ancient

554
00:26:48,920 --> 00:26:53,200
mythology.
I would like to know like which

555
00:26:53,200 --> 00:26:56,000
non canonical?
Like where are the discrepancies

556
00:26:56,360 --> 00:26:57,920
and maybe later we could talk
about.

557
00:26:58,880 --> 00:27:02,760
Have we talked about the Canon?
Is tradition the driving factor?

558
00:27:02,760 --> 00:27:06,360
Are there other maybe more
objective elements or you know,

559
00:27:06,360 --> 00:27:09,720
like that might be interesting
to talk about, but I would like

560
00:27:09,720 --> 00:27:12,480
him to say like, hey, this is
the this is what part of the

561
00:27:12,480 --> 00:27:14,360
Dead Sea Scrolls undercuts
everything else like that would

562
00:27:14,360 --> 00:27:15,360
be helpful.
You know what?

563
00:27:15,360 --> 00:27:17,000
I.
Mean well, the Dead Sea Scrolls

564
00:27:17,080 --> 00:27:19,880
are not even New Testament
related.

565
00:27:19,880 --> 00:27:22,320
For the most part, they are.
It's like I yeah.

566
00:27:22,480 --> 00:27:24,560
They are Old Testament they.
It's like.

567
00:27:24,760 --> 00:27:31,120
From 250 BC to around 100 AD,
the manuscripts found there and

568
00:27:31,120 --> 00:27:34,040
what they do.
I just gave you a We spent a

569
00:27:34,040 --> 00:27:38,840
long time basically giving you
the textual criticism argument

570
00:27:38,920 --> 00:27:40,720
for why the New Testament is
sound.

571
00:27:41,040 --> 00:27:43,400
If I were to be asked to do the
same thing for the Old

572
00:27:43,400 --> 00:27:46,000
Testament, I would go to the
Dead Sea Scrolls cause what we

573
00:27:46,000 --> 00:27:49,960
had before that were the
Masoretic Text which dated to be

574
00:27:49,960 --> 00:27:55,840
around 900 AD.
And so we had almost 1000 year

575
00:27:55,840 --> 00:28:00,320
gap that was and there are like
hardly no differences.

576
00:28:00,560 --> 00:28:01,640
I've even heard.
Between.

577
00:28:02,720 --> 00:28:05,760
Isaiah scrolling specifically is
like literally word for word the

578
00:28:05,760 --> 00:28:09,680
same, which is insane because to
your point, it's like the Dead

579
00:28:09,680 --> 00:28:12,080
Sea Scrolls have actually like
confirmed a lot.

580
00:28:12,880 --> 00:28:15,800
So I would that's so all that
say I would like him to say like

581
00:28:15,800 --> 00:28:19,000
this is the specifics, because
that's like hard to in my mind,

582
00:28:19,000 --> 00:28:23,160
it confirms rather than tears
apart, but so be I'd like to

583
00:28:23,160 --> 00:28:24,120
know that.
Yeah.

584
00:28:24,120 --> 00:28:27,120
And and just to kind of speak to
I, I, so the, the things that we

585
00:28:27,120 --> 00:28:31,960
reject, we, we, we reject the
Apocrypha as scripture.

586
00:28:32,400 --> 00:28:34,520
We don't reject it as
historical.

587
00:28:34,600 --> 00:28:35,360
Books.
Right.

588
00:28:36,240 --> 00:28:38,520
It's a historical book.
We reject it as Scripture

589
00:28:38,520 --> 00:28:42,520
because for several reasons, the
Jews treated it differently.

590
00:28:42,800 --> 00:28:46,240
No one, none of the apostles or
Jesus referred to it or quoted

591
00:28:46,240 --> 00:28:49,080
from it.
And there's some things in there

592
00:28:49,080 --> 00:28:52,080
that contradict the what the
apostles and Jesus taught.

593
00:28:52,080 --> 00:28:54,960
So for those reasons, we like,
hey, good history.

594
00:28:55,760 --> 00:28:58,600
Maybe it's worth, you know,
reading just to understand, but

595
00:28:58,600 --> 00:29:00,880
we don't put it in the category
of Scripture.

596
00:29:01,320 --> 00:29:04,360
And then there are some gospels
like the Gospel of Thomas that

597
00:29:04,360 --> 00:29:07,920
came out way later.
We're talking about the end of

598
00:29:07,920 --> 00:29:11,880
the one hundreds, beginning of
the two hundreds, and the style

599
00:29:11,880 --> 00:29:13,960
is completely like if if you
read.

600
00:29:14,040 --> 00:29:15,720
The Gospel, Thomas.
It's not.

601
00:29:16,520 --> 00:29:18,040
It's not Matthew.
Right, right.

602
00:29:18,040 --> 00:29:20,520
It's not Matthew.
I, I, I'm gonna, I wanna pull

603
00:29:20,800 --> 00:29:22,720
some gospel.
I'm 99% sure.

604
00:29:22,720 --> 00:29:25,240
Like Jesus was like a lot of
this.

605
00:29:25,240 --> 00:29:28,880
He's a kid and he like, does
like he plays tricks on people

606
00:29:28,880 --> 00:29:30,360
with his miracles.
Like it's kind of funny.

607
00:29:30,360 --> 00:29:31,600
It's like a dentist.
The menace, kind of.

608
00:29:31,600 --> 00:29:33,560
There's some chicken or
something that he raises from

609
00:29:33,560 --> 00:29:38,880
the dead in in the in there.
There's a lot and read Michael

610
00:29:38,880 --> 00:29:41,600
Kruger's book.
I don't remember the name of it.

611
00:29:41,600 --> 00:29:45,480
It's something like how we got
to the Canon, but he goes

612
00:29:45,480 --> 00:29:50,800
through basically by the end of
the one hundreds people had

613
00:29:50,800 --> 00:29:53,840
known.
These are the writings of Paul.

614
00:29:54,120 --> 00:29:56,720
These are the writings of Peter.
These are the writings of John.

615
00:29:56,720 --> 00:29:59,760
And so there was a community
agreement.

616
00:29:59,760 --> 00:30:01,440
Were there some outliers?
Sure.

617
00:30:01,480 --> 00:30:04,440
Like we they debated Hebrews,
they debated James.

618
00:30:05,000 --> 00:30:08,400
But you could, you could toss
Hebrews and James out, and you'd

619
00:30:08,400 --> 00:30:12,000
lose some of the color and some
of the details, but you're not

620
00:30:12,000 --> 00:30:15,000
losing the core of the message
of the New Testament.

621
00:30:15,720 --> 00:30:18,480
I love it.
So 13 Shadow Wolf.

622
00:30:18,480 --> 00:30:21,800
I hope I hope that was helpful.
I I would I would have loved.

623
00:30:21,800 --> 00:30:24,920
I think that would give good
content too, to like look at

624
00:30:24,920 --> 00:30:27,800
what because because maybe he
was thinking of, you know, one

625
00:30:27,800 --> 00:30:29,640
of these Gnostic gospels or
something like that.

626
00:30:29,640 --> 00:30:31,880
He's saying this is different
and we would probably agree that

627
00:30:31,880 --> 00:30:33,800
these are different.
You know, it doesn't undercut

628
00:30:33,800 --> 00:30:35,480
because we would separate from
them, you know?

629
00:30:35,720 --> 00:30:40,120
And then the other thing I do
want to to he mentioned like

630
00:30:40,120 --> 00:30:42,560
copying myths.
Oh, yeah, he did.

631
00:30:42,560 --> 00:30:48,280
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
And so Reformed Lutheran satire.

632
00:30:48,520 --> 00:30:51,120
Nice.
I think it's just Lutheran has

633
00:30:51,200 --> 00:30:56,280
this great video that does it
kind of through satire.

634
00:30:56,280 --> 00:30:59,240
So it's going to be a little
pokey funny, but if maybe we can

635
00:30:59,240 --> 00:31:01,600
link it.
But he kind of goes through all

636
00:31:01,600 --> 00:31:05,120
these different myths and kind
of shows how they don't fit.

637
00:31:06,040 --> 00:31:09,560
This was the Internet craze.
There's a guy I worked with who

638
00:31:10,360 --> 00:31:15,400
grew up as a Mormon, rejected
Mormonism and kind of in that

639
00:31:15,400 --> 00:31:18,000
rejected all faith.
Like I got fooled once.

640
00:31:18,000 --> 00:31:18,960
I'm not going to get fooled
again.

641
00:31:19,280 --> 00:31:21,840
And he made this passing comment
to me one, one time.

642
00:31:21,840 --> 00:31:26,520
And he was like, well, you know
how all the, the, the 12

643
00:31:27,040 --> 00:31:30,120
disciples like that was Osiris
and stuff like that.

644
00:31:30,120 --> 00:31:33,200
And I was like, Don, you're a
smart guy.

645
00:31:33,880 --> 00:31:37,720
Go look into this and you will
find it does not like that

646
00:31:37,720 --> 00:31:41,000
Zeitgeist movie that came out
and everything that quoted it

647
00:31:41,000 --> 00:31:43,640
afterwards.
That is not sound.

648
00:31:44,080 --> 00:31:46,080
And to his credit, he did and he
came back.

649
00:31:46,080 --> 00:31:47,800
He's like, you know what, you
are totally right.

650
00:31:47,800 --> 00:31:50,280
I just accepted what what I
heard.

651
00:31:51,720 --> 00:31:56,080
But you can read this stuff.
The like we said, there's a

652
00:31:56,080 --> 00:31:58,960
difference between the real
agnostics.

653
00:31:58,960 --> 00:32:03,240
You read Luke's introduction.
It's not like Once Upon a Time

654
00:32:03,240 --> 00:32:04,400
fairy tale.
That's right.

655
00:32:04,600 --> 00:32:07,960
And the introduction to John,
you know, in the beginning, as

656
00:32:07,960 --> 00:32:10,200
much as we saw, we held, we saw
these things.

657
00:32:10,280 --> 00:32:11,920
I'm telling you this so you can
believe.

658
00:32:12,120 --> 00:32:14,280
Yeah, yeah.
It's rooted in history.

659
00:32:14,680 --> 00:32:19,840
Now that that that's great, what
other things do we want to hit

660
00:32:19,920 --> 00:32:22,280
on this?
Yeah.

661
00:32:22,280 --> 00:32:25,800
So maybe we could just go
through some of these on, you

662
00:32:25,800 --> 00:32:27,680
know, the copycat Messiah.
Let's do it.

663
00:32:28,480 --> 00:32:32,800
So the claim is that Jesus is a
remix of Older Dying Rising?

664
00:32:32,800 --> 00:32:34,920
Yeah.
These things are like baked into

665
00:32:35,120 --> 00:32:37,520
every civilization had these
kind of things.

666
00:32:37,520 --> 00:32:43,000
Mithras, Dionysus, Osiris,
Horus, Addis, Krishna, Isis.

667
00:32:43,760 --> 00:32:46,040
There was an Internet video
called the Zeitgeist I already

668
00:32:46,040 --> 00:32:50,120
alluded to, and one of the
things that Zeitgeist says

669
00:32:50,120 --> 00:32:53,760
Horace was born on December 25th
of the virgin Isis, Mary

670
00:32:54,400 --> 00:32:57,360
crucified, buried for three days
and thus resurrected.

671
00:32:57,760 --> 00:32:58,960
Yeah.
Oh, wow.

672
00:32:58,960 --> 00:33:01,960
All those things.
Other gods were cited, All all

673
00:33:01,960 --> 00:33:05,040
allegedly with virgin births,
December 25th, birthdays,

674
00:33:05,040 --> 00:33:07,600
miracles, death and
resurrection.

675
00:33:08,000 --> 00:33:12,320
Dan Brown's Da Vinci Code quotes
it saying nothing in

676
00:33:12,320 --> 00:33:17,440
Christianity is original.
The problem are that the facts

677
00:33:17,640 --> 00:33:19,560
of what we just covered are
often false.

678
00:33:19,560 --> 00:33:21,240
Yeah, that's a big part of his
argument.

679
00:33:21,640 --> 00:33:25,720
Facts are important.
Cyrus Osiris never resurrected

680
00:33:25,720 --> 00:33:28,440
bodily.
Egyptian religion had no concept

681
00:33:28,440 --> 00:33:31,800
of resurrection.
Horace was not born of a virgin,

682
00:33:31,800 --> 00:33:35,040
in fact he never dies.
Jesus's birthday, December 25th

683
00:33:35,040 --> 00:33:37,600
is not even biblical like that
was chosen later.

684
00:33:37,600 --> 00:33:41,840
So we did a whole episode on
25th how it might like there's

685
00:33:41,840 --> 00:33:45,880
the small small small chance of
of some stuff that could be

686
00:33:46,760 --> 00:33:51,320
Mithras emerged from a rock.
He wasn't virgin born no death,

687
00:33:51,320 --> 00:33:54,520
no resurrection, no disciples.
Addis no evidence of a bodily

688
00:33:54,520 --> 00:33:57,200
resurrection.
Dionysus no virgin birth Krishna

689
00:33:57,760 --> 00:33:59,480
mother had seven previous
children.

690
00:33:59,480 --> 00:34:01,680
So you're saying not a virgin
birth either?

691
00:34:01,920 --> 00:34:07,400
Not a virgin, just checking.
And then the ones that are the

692
00:34:07,400 --> 00:34:09,480
closest to.
So they're like, if you look

693
00:34:09,480 --> 00:34:14,199
into Mithras, there's a lot that
does parallel Jesus.

694
00:34:14,719 --> 00:34:17,480
The problem is those details
come out after Jesus.

695
00:34:17,480 --> 00:34:19,360
Which would give, yeah, give
Creedism.

696
00:34:19,520 --> 00:34:21,080
They're the ones that are
copycats.

697
00:34:21,120 --> 00:34:26,280
Right, so Mithras is mentioned
before Jesus but not in any

698
00:34:26,280 --> 00:34:31,480
detail and the and the sources
that give detail to Mithras and

699
00:34:31,480 --> 00:34:33,960
have these parallels to Jesus
come out after him.

700
00:34:34,400 --> 00:34:39,440
So Mithras appears in Rome only
late 1st century AD Bull

701
00:34:39,440 --> 00:34:42,520
sacrifice element wasn't it
didn't come around until 2nd

702
00:34:42,520 --> 00:34:44,880
century.
Resurrection of Adonis, 2nd to

703
00:34:44,880 --> 00:34:47,880
4th century, the birth of
Zorastra 9th century.

704
00:34:47,880 --> 00:34:50,480
So all these things.
Even somewhere before, like the

705
00:34:50,480 --> 00:34:53,280
addition to all these things, it
just keeps growing, but it's

706
00:34:53,280 --> 00:35:00,440
adding afterwards I.
See, so my friend and mentor

707
00:35:01,040 --> 00:35:05,040
Greg Kochel, he has an article
on this that we'll link called

708
00:35:05,040 --> 00:35:07,720
Jesus Just a Recycled Redeemer,
where he goes through all of

709
00:35:07,720 --> 00:35:10,520
these facts and in more detail.
So we're going by pretty fast.

710
00:35:11,400 --> 00:35:14,000
Here's the problem.
Let's say that all these claims

711
00:35:14,000 --> 00:35:17,920
are true.
Let's say that Osiris did have

712
00:35:17,920 --> 00:35:21,640
all those things.
You still have to judge Jesus

713
00:35:21,640 --> 00:35:25,440
based on the facts that support
the claims for him.

714
00:35:25,960 --> 00:35:29,680
So just because you could say
Osiris had all these

715
00:35:29,680 --> 00:35:32,720
similarities doesn't mean you
can say well then Jesus must be

716
00:35:32,720 --> 00:35:35,720
false.
You have to 1st prove that the

717
00:35:36,040 --> 00:35:40,880
claims of Jesus are false based
on their own merits before you

718
00:35:40,880 --> 00:35:44,120
throw it out and and say, oh, we
know where we these came from.

719
00:35:44,520 --> 00:35:46,680
They came because they're a copy
of this and.

720
00:35:46,680 --> 00:35:49,040
And there's a lot of evidence.
I I mean, if you, even if you

721
00:35:49,040 --> 00:35:52,560
don't believe resurrection, that
kind of thing, that historically

722
00:35:53,080 --> 00:35:57,000
Jesus existed as a real man at a
real time in a real place, like

723
00:35:57,000 --> 00:35:59,200
there are records pointing to
that.

724
00:35:59,440 --> 00:36:01,160
Yeah, that we would use for
anyone else.

725
00:36:01,160 --> 00:36:05,120
I went to find it and someone
took the YouTube down.

726
00:36:05,640 --> 00:36:09,680
But there is Bart Ehrman, who
wrote all these books about the

727
00:36:09,680 --> 00:36:11,160
Bible.
And Bart Ehrman's not a

728
00:36:11,160 --> 00:36:15,880
believer, but someone said
something in one of his

729
00:36:16,760 --> 00:36:18,800
conferences.
Like, you know, why do people

730
00:36:18,800 --> 00:36:21,080
even believe that Jesus ever
existed?

731
00:36:21,080 --> 00:36:22,800
And he, like, he takes him to
task.

732
00:36:22,880 --> 00:36:25,680
Oh, yeah.
And like says if if anyone of

733
00:36:25,680 --> 00:36:28,200
antiquity existed?
Yeah, he was the guy.

734
00:36:28,200 --> 00:36:30,280
Like we can't say anyone else
did like you.

735
00:36:30,400 --> 00:36:32,880
You.
There's no evidence as much as

736
00:36:32,880 --> 00:36:33,680
there is for.
Jesus.

737
00:36:33,720 --> 00:36:42,200
Yeah, there's this book written
in late 1800s called The Titan.

738
00:36:42,960 --> 00:36:46,000
And.
It's about this boat that is

739
00:36:46,000 --> 00:36:51,560
supposedly unsinkable and it
hits an iceberg and sinks right?

740
00:36:51,560 --> 00:36:53,280
And you're like, that sounds
like something.

741
00:36:53,520 --> 00:36:58,200
You could not in 1915 say, I
don't believe the Titanic was

742
00:36:58,200 --> 00:37:02,080
true because all that was just
based on this book that was

743
00:37:02,080 --> 00:37:05,640
written 20-30 years earlier.
Like, yeah, it's an amazing

744
00:37:05,640 --> 00:37:09,400
coincidence, but you'd have to
judge the Titanic on its own

745
00:37:09,400 --> 00:37:12,600
merits, You know, are the
eyewitnesses believable?

746
00:37:12,600 --> 00:37:14,360
Do we have evidence, all those
things?

747
00:37:14,800 --> 00:37:16,920
And so that's what I'm saying,
even if there are these

748
00:37:16,920 --> 00:37:19,200
similarities, you can't just
reject them out of hand.

749
00:37:19,200 --> 00:37:23,840
You got to judge Jesus based on
his evidence and come to some

750
00:37:23,840 --> 00:37:28,480
type of conclusion.
No, I like that to to the going

751
00:37:28,480 --> 00:37:30,560
back to point Jesus, real man,
real place in time.

752
00:37:30,560 --> 00:37:33,640
When you contrast that with some
of these Pagan gods, it, it

753
00:37:33,640 --> 00:37:36,800
seems like things came with the
seasons, like there is this

754
00:37:36,800 --> 00:37:39,560
cultic rituals maybe and and
it's like, Hey, it's the

755
00:37:39,560 --> 00:37:44,040
springtime, whatever versus this
one time historical.

756
00:37:44,040 --> 00:37:49,600
Well, you know, study events and
Jesus is very unique.

757
00:37:49,760 --> 00:37:52,360
It wasn't like one of these
Pagan gods that you're trying to

758
00:37:52,360 --> 00:37:55,480
satisfy.
You know, it's like 1 one time

759
00:37:55,480 --> 00:37:59,680
vicarious sacrifice for sin in a
very special unique way.

760
00:38:00,000 --> 00:38:01,720
Yeah.
And if you are interested in

761
00:38:01,720 --> 00:38:05,880
digging into it, look into Jay
Warner Wallace's person of

762
00:38:05,880 --> 00:38:10,320
interest because he details how
the life of Jesus and the impact

763
00:38:10,320 --> 00:38:14,000
he had on his followers and
those who come to know him and

764
00:38:14,000 --> 00:38:17,320
his teaching.
How it changed all of history in

765
00:38:17,320 --> 00:38:21,800
almost every sector, healthcare,
education, arts, you know,

766
00:38:21,800 --> 00:38:26,280
writing, reading, all the, you
know, all these impacts that,

767
00:38:26,520 --> 00:38:29,080
you know, happen because of who
Jesus is.

768
00:38:30,040 --> 00:38:33,440
And those didn't happen with
those other myth so.

769
00:38:34,000 --> 00:38:36,440
Yeah, very, very different.
And I like that even people like

770
00:38:36,840 --> 00:38:40,640
true historians will go to task
for that, you know?

771
00:38:41,000 --> 00:38:44,040
No other person has as many
songs written about him and good

772
00:38:44,040 --> 00:38:48,600
or bad, that talk about who
Jesus was and through history.

773
00:38:48,920 --> 00:38:50,920
Pretty incredible.
It's crazy, man.

774
00:38:51,240 --> 00:38:55,480
Well, anything else you got?
No, obviously one of the

775
00:38:55,480 --> 00:39:01,160
comments we have is, yeah, give
us the specifics.

776
00:39:01,160 --> 00:39:03,200
So if you've got specifics.
Specifics are great.

777
00:39:03,280 --> 00:39:06,080
That helps us because then we.
Just go back and forth saying

778
00:39:06,080 --> 00:39:08,000
like we think the Bible's true
and they'll be like, I heard

779
00:39:08,000 --> 00:39:09,200
it's not.
And you're like, well, I heard,

780
00:39:09,200 --> 00:39:10,960
I know, I know it's true, and
it's not helpful.

781
00:39:11,000 --> 00:39:11,960
Yeah.
So if there is some

782
00:39:11,960 --> 00:39:16,240
inconsistency or contradiction
that you are aware of, give it

783
00:39:16,240 --> 00:39:17,360
to us and we'll that would be
awesome.

784
00:39:17,360 --> 00:39:20,000
We, you know, we dive into it
and kind of show how it's, you

785
00:39:20,000 --> 00:39:22,200
know, can be ironed out.
I love it.

786
00:39:22,200 --> 00:39:25,560
And to that end, maybe next
month, one of these days, we're

787
00:39:25,560 --> 00:39:28,840
going to dive back into that
that threat and get back on the

788
00:39:28,840 --> 00:39:30,480
more arguments.
So that is great.

789
00:39:30,520 --> 00:39:32,120
I like these.
These are good.

790
00:39:33,560 --> 00:39:37,600
Thanks for, you know, just and
you should just do some someone

791
00:39:37,600 --> 00:39:40,240
should just do a silly comment.
Just throw throw it off a little

792
00:39:40,240 --> 00:39:43,120
bit, you know, but it take us to
make us get down a rabbit hole

793
00:39:43,120 --> 00:39:45,760
or something.
But anyway, I think I think that

794
00:39:45,760 --> 00:39:48,360
is good for this episode.
That's our take.

795
00:39:49,920 --> 00:39:53,040
Thanks for listening to Take 2.
Find us wherever you find

796
00:39:53,040 --> 00:39:55,560
podcasts and on YouTube for
those who want to watch our

797
00:39:55,560 --> 00:39:56,240
video cast.