Nov. 11, 2024
That's Not Right | Romans 9:19-33
Episode 83
Is it right that God chooses to have mercy on some but not others? See how Paul responds to this objection.
Original sermon here: https://www.sermonaudio.com/sermons/11324191063820
Find our videocast here: https://youtu.be/0XwAXFmD8BQ
Music from #Uppbeat (free for Creators!):
https://uppbeat.io/t/reakt-music/deep-stone
License code: 2QZOZ2YHZ5UTE7C8
Find more Take 2 Theology content at https://take2pod.wordpress.com/
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All right, we are back.
We have stolen the mics back
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from the wives.
They are back in the, should we,
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I shouldn't say back in the
kitchen.
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That would be that would be.
But we love and cherish our
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wives.
Of course, but a little note for
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Leanne and Jill.
Just be careful what you say
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because the mics come back.
Right.
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They do come back and she did
tell, Jill told me that they're
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going to talk about the, their
engagement stories, which has
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always been a tough one for me.
And I, I, I thought she was
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going to make it worse than what
it was.
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But I appreciated, you know,
'cause I did have a plan.
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And then the, the Fernando
Ortega concert got cancelled.
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And then I was like, OK, we'll
come up with a different plan.
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And I was thinking about maybe
going out to there was like a
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Country Club, like with a gazebo
or something and proposing out
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there.
And then like we're driving
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down.
And it wasn't, it wasn't the
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actual ring thing that was in my
pocket, but it was like the
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cardboard box that the ring came
in.
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And I did not do a good job of
I, I thought I had it hidden,
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but apparently it wasn't hidden.
And then it was like just
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derailed from there.
So I was like, oh, everything
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was like unscripted.
But how many years have you ever
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married?
22 I.
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Was like oh I'm not trying to
help you dig a deep Rd. that was
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great but 20?
Two years later.
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We're going strong.
You go on duck hunts and things
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are good.
It's like that's that's a test
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of a strong marriage, you know?
So.
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Worked out, Yeah.
I was trying to think of of
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things Leanne, Leanne said on
there.
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There she said something about
me and the doorbell.
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What?
What did she say?
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Yeah, that that she the best
thing she got this little
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electronic doorbell and that you
don't like it when you're up
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there.
It always like scares you 'cause
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you're not used.
To too much too.
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It's actually a great idea.
But you know, honestly, I
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thought, I thought they'd.
We actually haven't aired their
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episode yet, but I'm assuming
yeah.
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We've heard it though.
Yeah, we've heard it, and you'll
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have heard it by the time you're
hearing this.
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Yeah, 'cause we're recording
this just a little bit early.
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One question Jill had 'cause she
had she your wife was talking
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about y'all's engagement and
walking along the beach, and
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then there was a blue light in
the sand, and the blue light was
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never explained like what it
was.
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Yeah, my memory might be failing
me, so Leanne can.
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How long have y'all been
married?
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Not 20 years to I wow, I think
12 years now that I'm on the
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mic, I'm losing 2012 twelve.
Yeah, yeah.
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So we we had a 12 year mark.
OK, so so we were what?
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What month were you all married?
August 11th.
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So we're exactly 10 years apart,
almost 'cause we were.
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August 4th, 2002.
August 11th, 2012.
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Wow, so you're saying what I'm
hearing is you got my back like
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your your anniversary comes
first, so if you guys are
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celebrating yours, I know all I
got to get on my game.
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But this blue light Leanne was
trying her best to just totally
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ruin this engagement at every
every step she could
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unknowingly.
Like I had a message in a
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bottle.
She talked about it, but she was
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like, I don't wanna touch a
gross, gross bottle.
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Like, no, I'm like, maybe it's
not gross.
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Maybe it's really important you
wanna grab that Did it?
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I think the blue light might
have been maybe it was like
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marking like a spot, like I had
light.
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I had like a it was like old
school had a remote and then
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when I pressed it a bunch of
lights.
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But but I think I might have had
one already blinking or there so
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I knew where to go where
everything because I was on the
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beach.
It was dark.
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I'll tell you what too, just a
lot of extension cord going
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everywhere.
It was it was kind of crazy.
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I'll have to show pictures we.
Yeah, if you give me pictures.
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Oh, show up.
I could put them up here.
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It's like one of those the
camera like we didn't have like
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professional pictures taken in
the moment, but we had like,
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it's like, you know, like when
you take a picture in the dark
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and there's lights and the
lights are like running, like,
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you know, moving.
There's a lot of that going on
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where it's kind of crazy, but
documentation that actually
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happened so.
Talking about trying to make
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things go awry unknowingly,
Chris had gotten some.
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Have you heard this story?
And he proposed Luana.
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I don't think I had.
He got some Cracker Jacks and he
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put the ring inside the little,
the little toy so that, you
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know, and, and when Luana got
it, she was about to throw it
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off the Cliff 'cause they're
always like, she's like, these
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are just cheap little toys.
And he's like, no, no, no.
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No, yeah, don't throw that one.
They crack.
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Do people still do Cracker Jack
boxes?
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Have they taken like they used
to be a thing when I was
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kidding?
I know they were like before
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that.
I haven't seen a Cracker Jack
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box in a minute.
I think you can maybe find them
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at Dollar General and and
Cracker Barrel or something like
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that, but they used to be big
everywhere.
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Yeah, it.
Used to be the thing but that
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that's smart.
Put the nice ring in there and
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just out that we'll have to ask
about that next, maybe next home
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groups he can he can share that
engagement stories.
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If, if she had thrown that off,
Chris could have said that's not
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right.
I I.
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Was looking for what we did too.
So Michael beat me to the punch.
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Title of the sermon today.
The 28th sermon in Romans is
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God.
That's not right.
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Really this response that that
Paul is hypothetically, you
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know, raising and answering in
Romans 9.
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So let's go ahead and take it to
the next level from the hearts
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of the low country in South
Carolina.
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It's the Take Two podcast where
we take theology to the next
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level.
Romans 9.
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Romans 9 A tough.
One pastor's working his way
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through it really well.
And you know what, what pastor
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does well, he does several
things well.
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I think what he's done well in
this passage in particular is he
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has stuck so close to the text.
He's not doing a ton of these
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outside illustrations.
He's trying to use the text
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illustrations.
And on top of that, he was
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doing, and he's staying in the,
he's really reviewing this
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context, which he will do.
But he did this really cool
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thing.
We got a couple of the younger
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children, like teenage, like
young adults, I don't know, like
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12:15.
Something 10. 12 Yeah, to
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actually participate.
In.
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An illustration those kids will
probably never forget Romans 9.
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That's right, that's right,
'cause he gave them some clay
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and said here, here, make
something with the clay.
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And one of them made a, a fairly
nice cross with the heart.
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The other one, I'm not sure what
he was making.
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He he asked for some extension,
some extra time.
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It's good.
It's a good lesson in
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illustration.
Sometimes I struggle with
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illustrations.
I want to get the text right and
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I people have all sorts of
illustrations.
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Sometimes they can really drive
home a point or help you
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understand, but sometimes pick
and distract.
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If someone's not careful about
like tied, you're like, that's
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like the only thing I remember
or I can't tie it to the point
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or didn't really make the point.
It was kind of adjacent.
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It's kind of hard to weave in
like perfect ones, but it can't
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get more perfect than taking it
directly.
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From the test, no, that's good.
That's good.
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Often times when I'm teaching
it'll be the next day I'm like,
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oh, that would have been a
perfect way to illustrate that.
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And So what I've tried to do
now, especially if I'm teaching
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a sermon or something, I'll try
to maybe type it up a little bit
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a couple days ahead of time.
And that way because I'm, I, I'm
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generally busy enough that I'm
like on Saturday, if I'm
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preaching for Joel, like that's
the day I'm like trying to pull
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everything together.
And that really, you know, I
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think there's something that
your mind does kind of in the
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background.
Sometimes it it you think of
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things a day or two afterwards
you.
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Know that that that that that's
good.
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The kind of things we're
wrestling with today that Pastor
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Joel really helped explain are,
you know, this idea we're
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working our way through Romans
9.
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It's it's really not fair that
that God chose to extend mercy
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to some but not others.
And if that's how things go when
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God is sovereign, it's how is it
right that he holds people
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accountable?
He's got this quote by William
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McDonald.
It, you know, it's some ways it
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seems like we're all pawns on a
divine checkerboard.
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What agency do we have if this
is the case?
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So I think really good.
Questions.
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What checker game William
McDonald is playing that has
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pawns in it?
You know what I'm saying?
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That's what I was wondering, was
like pawns on the checkerboard
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OK?
Spoken like that.
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What what what?
What's your?
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What's the title?
Are you a chess coach?
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A chess sponsor?
Like what?
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Yeah, I get called both of
those.
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Yeah.
Chess coach, chess sponsor.
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Yeah, do.
Do do it all well, what we can
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jump into, It's so helpful.
Everyone just like takes a
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passage in Romans 9 and fights
about it, but it's like work
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your way back up to that context
and see the big picture.
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And then you kind of you kind of
get a lay of the land.
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Yeah, that's good.
And So what Joel has
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consistently done is taken us
back to the end of Chapter 8
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where we see this.
What has some have termed the
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golden chain of redemption.
It's kind of starts off in 828.
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And we know that God causes all
things to work together for good
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to those who love God, to those
who are called according to his
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purpose.
And then here it comes.
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For those whom he foreknew, he
also predestined to become
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conformed to the image of his
Son, so that he would be the
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first born among many brethren.
And those whom he predestined,
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he also called.
And these whom he called he also
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justified, and these whom he
justified he also glorified.
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Those are all past tense
Speaking of, you know, this past
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action that had ongoing effects.
But really you get that.
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And then you read the end where
it says nothing's going to
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separate us from the love of
God.
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Huge things.
But then someone might be going
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Paul, just look around you.
What's going on with the Jews?
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They're they're falling away.
They're not.
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Not all of them believe has Has
his promises failed.
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It's it's such, such a good
thing to consider because I
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think of myself and I think of
my brothers and sisters at
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Charleston Bible Church and my
view is most of these people
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have a relationship with God.
This is great.
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But Can you imagine being in a
context where you look around
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and you're like, man, good news
for me.
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Sure, But it's like, why has why
is this not worked out?
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You know, if Jews were God's
chosen people.
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So I think that that's good.
Just like you just mentioned
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that verse, verse 6, has the
glory to God failed.
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It's it's keeping that in mind.
It hasn't failed.
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And Paul, Paul's going on saying
This is why because God is
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sovereign, it has not failed.
We've got this quote we've
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mentioned a few times by Douglas
Moo.
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If God's plan depended on the
vagaries of sinful human beings
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for its continuance, then indeed
God's word were to fall into the
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ground long ago.
But God's purpose and history is
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fulfilled because he himself
elects people to be part of that
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purpose that it all hinges on
God hinges on me, man.
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I do a lot of things good.
I do far more things bad or drop
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the ball or miss something,
yeah.
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Yeah.
So this section, last sermon and
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this sermon are what could be
formally called a diatribe.
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00:10:37,000 --> 00:10:39,520
We use that word a lot of times.
Oh, that person just went on
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00:10:39,520 --> 00:10:44,240
diatribe like this is the formal
and Webster and Marian actually
228
00:10:44,240 --> 00:10:50,440
call it the archaic definition,
but it's a prolonged discourse.
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00:10:50,440 --> 00:10:53,840
But we're going to see Paul
engaged in a prolonged discourse
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against these hypothetical
objectors.
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00:10:56,400 --> 00:10:58,080
And that's what we covered last
week.
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You know, it's not fair.
And in what the question is, if
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God has mercy on some but
doesn't have mercy on all, then
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we don't think that's fair.
And then what we're going to
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look at today is that God is
going to, you know, if that's
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the case, then how can he hold
us accountable?
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00:11:18,680 --> 00:11:20,400
And so we would say that's not
right, God.
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Yeah, that that's the objection
Paul is anticipating.
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00:11:23,680 --> 00:11:25,960
Who can resist his will?
How can God find fault?
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How can God be just all this?
All these thoughts are running
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00:11:29,720 --> 00:11:35,880
through the Paul.
Paul and maybe his people is
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like these Jews that they're
mind.
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00:11:37,400 --> 00:11:40,120
And so here's the answer up
front, you know, doesn't the
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00:11:40,120 --> 00:11:43,920
Potter have right over the clay
to make from the same lump 1
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00:11:43,920 --> 00:11:47,440
vessel for honorable use and
another for common use.
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00:11:47,440 --> 00:11:50,560
So that's the answer.
We'll go ahead and develop it
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because it, it is a hard, it is
emotional thing for, you know,
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what fairness actually is versus
what we want.
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00:11:58,000 --> 00:12:02,160
Yeah, I, I think, 'cause when I
talk with people and I've said,
250
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well, God could send us all to
hell.
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Yeah, he could.
And that would be fine.
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Or God could send everyone to
heaven and that would be fine.
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Or I think that they that they
would want it to depend on the
254
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person, but the person is making
the difference.
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00:12:18,800 --> 00:12:22,400
The person is deciding, OK, I
want to choose God because those
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00:12:22,400 --> 00:12:26,160
all seem OK with us.
Either, you know, universalism,
257
00:12:26,240 --> 00:12:29,760
everyone gets saved.
I don't know what the name is.
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00:12:29,760 --> 00:12:32,120
If we all go to hell, universal
justice.
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00:12:32,160 --> 00:12:34,520
I don't know.
Yeah, we don't really want that,
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00:12:34,520 --> 00:12:37,920
but we'd say it's fair.
Or if, hey, God kind of brings.
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00:12:37,920 --> 00:12:40,320
And I think this is what the
typical Armenian does, Everyone,
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00:12:40,360 --> 00:12:43,280
God brings everyone kind of up
to the same level.
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00:12:43,600 --> 00:12:46,240
And then they decide, you know,
it depends on the personal.
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00:12:46,240 --> 00:12:49,720
The Bible explicitly says it
does not depend on the man that
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00:12:49,720 --> 00:12:52,600
runs, but it depends on God.
And that's what people are
266
00:12:52,600 --> 00:12:54,920
uncomfortable with.
It, it's very uncomfortable,
267
00:12:54,920 --> 00:12:57,720
even even if I know Scripture to
see something, it's just
268
00:12:57,720 --> 00:13:00,800
something in you.
Like I think pastor as he was
269
00:13:00,800 --> 00:13:03,440
talking through it, like maybe
struggle's not the right word.
270
00:13:03,440 --> 00:13:05,400
Maybe it is, but it's something
that you have any you're like,
271
00:13:05,480 --> 00:13:08,120
but we, you know, submit to the
word of God.
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00:13:08,120 --> 00:13:12,160
So looking ahead at this
passage, Paul in verse 19 starts
273
00:13:12,360 --> 00:13:16,360
with the criticism that we
mentioned in verses 20 to 21.
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00:13:16,360 --> 00:13:21,040
We'll bring an illustration and
then the rest of the passage, 22
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00:13:21,040 --> 00:13:23,160
through 29.
He gives a little application,
276
00:13:23,720 --> 00:13:27,160
then wraps up a conclusion,
quotes some Old Testament text.
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00:13:27,520 --> 00:13:31,320
So we'll go ahead and work our
way through this, starting with
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00:13:31,320 --> 00:13:35,760
that criticism in verse 19.
Yeah, so this is verse 19.
279
00:13:35,760 --> 00:13:38,520
We're actually going to back up
to verse 18, it says.
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00:13:38,520 --> 00:13:42,360
So then he has mercy on whom he
desires, and he hardens whom he
281
00:13:42,360 --> 00:13:44,680
desires.
Who will say to me that why does
282
00:13:44,680 --> 00:13:47,920
he still find fault?
For who can resist his will or
283
00:13:47,920 --> 00:13:50,840
who resists his will?
Slipped into a different
284
00:13:51,040 --> 00:13:52,440
translation there that I had
memorized.
285
00:13:53,040 --> 00:13:57,680
We got a few few translations up
here and, and you read something
286
00:13:57,680 --> 00:14:01,280
like that and you get this idea
that, man, everything is rigged
287
00:14:01,280 --> 00:14:02,600
against us.
It's like what?
288
00:14:02,760 --> 00:14:05,000
How can you find fault?
Like if this is how it goes
289
00:14:05,000 --> 00:14:07,840
down, what can we do?
We mentioned pawns on a
290
00:14:07,840 --> 00:14:11,120
checkerboard and NLTS
translation.
291
00:14:11,120 --> 00:14:13,400
I like this as well.
Then you might say, why does God
292
00:14:13,400 --> 00:14:16,440
blame people for not responding?
Haven't they simply done what he
293
00:14:16,440 --> 00:14:18,520
makes them to do?
But I think this probably is the
294
00:14:18,520 --> 00:14:21,920
natural response.
And I think if I were answering
295
00:14:21,920 --> 00:14:24,520
this and not Paul, because
Paul's going to answer it
296
00:14:24,560 --> 00:14:28,040
clearly his way, I would go, OK,
well, let's go back to Adam.
297
00:14:28,520 --> 00:14:32,560
Adam was our, you can either say
he's our federal head or we were
298
00:14:32,560 --> 00:14:37,000
in him, like in a genetic
genealogical sense.
299
00:14:37,600 --> 00:14:39,680
And Adam sinned on behalf of all
of us.
300
00:14:40,120 --> 00:14:43,520
So we all sin, we all have
original sin, we're all guilty,
301
00:14:43,520 --> 00:14:47,160
we're all going our own way.
He punched all of us over this
302
00:14:47,160 --> 00:14:51,200
Cliff, and now we're all running
away from God, and God chooses
303
00:14:51,200 --> 00:14:55,080
to mercy some.
But Paul's answer is a little
304
00:14:55,080 --> 00:14:58,600
bit yeah, more punchy than.
Mine, it's very punchy and he
305
00:14:58,600 --> 00:15:00,040
just he doesn't beat around the
Bush.
306
00:15:00,040 --> 00:15:03,800
He gets right to the point.
I'm in verse 20 and 21 he says
307
00:15:03,920 --> 00:15:08,000
On the contrary, who are you, O
man who answers back to God?
308
00:15:08,320 --> 00:15:11,280
The thing molded will not say to
the molder, why'd you make me
309
00:15:11,280 --> 00:15:12,240
like this?
Will it?
310
00:15:12,720 --> 00:15:15,720
Or does the Potter have a right
over the clay to make from the
311
00:15:15,720 --> 00:15:20,120
same lump 1 vessel for honorable
use and another for common use?
312
00:15:20,280 --> 00:15:22,840
Basically, he's just going right
at this creator creature
313
00:15:22,840 --> 00:15:26,240
distinction that you're not like
God, your perspectives not like
314
00:15:26,240 --> 00:15:27,200
God.
Like how?
315
00:15:27,200 --> 00:15:29,560
Almost.
Yeah, how dare you like even
316
00:15:29,720 --> 00:15:32,840
even question in this tone.
You know what?
317
00:15:32,840 --> 00:15:36,200
What has got to do?
Yeah, because I, I can, I think
318
00:15:36,200 --> 00:15:38,600
we can all sympathize with the
concern.
319
00:15:39,000 --> 00:15:41,160
Yeah.
And Paul's going to be like,
320
00:15:41,160 --> 00:15:44,840
yeah, not I'm not really even
going to answer that because
321
00:15:44,840 --> 00:15:47,440
you're thinking the wrong way.
You're you're you're coming at
322
00:15:47,440 --> 00:15:48,000
this the wrong way.
He's.
323
00:15:48,000 --> 00:15:49,960
Just coming.
Yeah, I, I and I think he's just
324
00:15:49,960 --> 00:15:52,080
cutting it off right there on
the message.
325
00:15:52,720 --> 00:15:55,600
Says it this way.
And this really kind of maybe
326
00:15:55,600 --> 00:15:57,280
brings a little bit of flavor to
it.
327
00:15:57,560 --> 00:15:59,880
Who in the world do you think
you are to second guess God?
328
00:16:00,240 --> 00:16:03,760
Do you for one moment suppose
any of us know enough to call
329
00:16:03,760 --> 00:16:06,320
call God into question?
Clay doesn't talk back to the
330
00:16:06,320 --> 00:16:09,200
fingers that mold it, saying,
why'd you shape me like this?
331
00:16:09,600 --> 00:16:12,560
Isn't that obvious that a Potter
has a perfect right to shape 1
332
00:16:12,560 --> 00:16:16,120
Olympic clay into a vase for
holding flowers and another into
333
00:16:16,120 --> 00:16:18,920
a pot for cooking beans?
If God needs one style of
334
00:16:18,920 --> 00:16:21,520
pottery especially designed to
show his angry displeasure and
335
00:16:21,720 --> 00:16:24,560
another style carefully crafted
the show His glorious goodness,
336
00:16:25,120 --> 00:16:28,200
isn't that all right?
I like the Liberty's take with
337
00:16:28,200 --> 00:16:30,360
the message for the with the
evasive flowers with the cook.
338
00:16:30,360 --> 00:16:33,040
It's like different purposes.
And you know, we don't, you
339
00:16:33,040 --> 00:16:36,040
know, get mad at these, you
know, people who produce these
340
00:16:36,040 --> 00:16:37,720
different types of pottery and
this kind of thing.
341
00:16:38,080 --> 00:16:41,120
It's a it's a good argument.
Like you're saying, man, it's
342
00:16:41,120 --> 00:16:43,160
hard, hard.
It just hit pudges you in the
343
00:16:43,160 --> 00:16:44,120
face.
Yeah.
344
00:16:44,120 --> 00:16:48,480
And I, I have often prayed and
I, I would encourage you if you
345
00:16:48,680 --> 00:16:52,560
are a parent or you have loved
ones who you're praying for, I,
346
00:16:52,560 --> 00:16:55,800
I pray God, I ask you to make
them a vessel of honor.
347
00:16:56,480 --> 00:16:57,840
Like that's what my prayer is
for.
348
00:16:58,040 --> 00:17:03,040
It's been, I think the God of
eternity hears those prayers and
349
00:17:03,160 --> 00:17:06,800
you know, he can act like we're
asking God to move and to, to
350
00:17:06,800 --> 00:17:08,880
have compassion and mercy on
them.
351
00:17:08,880 --> 00:17:11,720
And I, and, and I think it's, it
can be tough.
352
00:17:11,960 --> 00:17:14,599
I know it's tough.
It's one thing for us to talk
353
00:17:14,599 --> 00:17:17,400
about this in the abstract.
It's tough when you have a
354
00:17:17,400 --> 00:17:19,119
family member you've been
praying for, for years and
355
00:17:19,119 --> 00:17:21,839
years, you've presented the
gospel, nothing seems to work.
356
00:17:21,839 --> 00:17:25,839
And you're like, and I think
there can be somewhat
357
00:17:25,839 --> 00:17:28,800
legitimate.
This doesn't seem fair.
358
00:17:28,840 --> 00:17:30,840
And this is what Paul is exactly
addressing.
359
00:17:31,320 --> 00:17:35,240
And you know, the pushback isn't
just limited to your everyday
360
00:17:35,240 --> 00:17:38,640
layperson.
Pastor Joe will often reference
361
00:17:38,640 --> 00:17:41,560
Barclays commentary,
particularly for its historical
362
00:17:41,600 --> 00:17:46,000
insight, and his notes here is
flat out man.
363
00:17:46,000 --> 00:17:50,160
Paul uses a bad analogy.
One great New Testament
364
00:17:50,280 --> 00:17:53,360
commentator said that this is
one of the few passages which we
365
00:17:53,360 --> 00:17:58,320
wish Paul had not written.
And that's that's, I mean, you
366
00:17:58,360 --> 00:18:00,360
think about writing a
commentary, that's one way to go
367
00:18:00,360 --> 00:18:03,040
to say like, I don't, I don't
this is bad.
368
00:18:03,040 --> 00:18:04,320
This is bad.
I don't like this.
369
00:18:04,320 --> 00:18:06,840
Paul made a mistake.
I don't know how you I'd like to
370
00:18:06,840 --> 00:18:10,720
read what that person says on
the passages that say all
371
00:18:10,720 --> 00:18:12,880
scripture is God breathed and
profitable.
372
00:18:12,880 --> 00:18:15,000
Like how did they interpret
that?
373
00:18:15,000 --> 00:18:18,080
And then because I'm assuming
they can still consider the
374
00:18:18,080 --> 00:18:18,720
script.
Sure.
375
00:18:19,240 --> 00:18:22,040
And you would think, and it's
one of those things, I mean, and
376
00:18:22,040 --> 00:18:25,800
on one sense, I definitely don't
agree with this take, but I kind
377
00:18:25,800 --> 00:18:29,000
of like the honesty there
instead of saying something
378
00:18:29,000 --> 00:18:32,880
like, well, what Paul is really
saying and then like watering it
379
00:18:32,880 --> 00:18:35,440
out to where he says nothing.
That's the other thing you can
380
00:18:35,520 --> 00:18:36,040
try.
I don't know.
381
00:18:36,280 --> 00:18:37,280
That's a tough one to do with
this.
382
00:18:37,280 --> 00:18:41,240
Passage said when he said X is,
what he really meant was Y, you
383
00:18:41,240 --> 00:18:44,040
know, and it's like.
People do that kind of thing.
384
00:18:44,640 --> 00:18:48,360
So that really sets up, you
know, the criticism, the
385
00:18:48,360 --> 00:18:50,800
analogy, this Potter and clay
analogy.
386
00:18:50,920 --> 00:18:56,520
Then Paul is going to move on to
application and 2222 through 29.
387
00:18:56,520 --> 00:18:59,200
We'll look at Application part
122 and 23.
388
00:18:59,600 --> 00:19:02,160
Yeah, so this covers verses
2223.
389
00:19:02,160 --> 00:19:06,360
It says, what if God, although
willing to demonstrate His wrath
390
00:19:06,920 --> 00:19:11,560
to make His power known, endured
with much, much patience vessels
391
00:19:11,560 --> 00:19:15,560
of wrath, prepared for
destruction, and He did so to
392
00:19:15,560 --> 00:19:18,720
make known the riches of His
glory upon vessels of mercy,
393
00:19:18,960 --> 00:19:21,120
which He prepared beforehand for
glory.
394
00:19:21,560 --> 00:19:24,720
And so kind of going back to
these, you know, the different
395
00:19:24,720 --> 00:19:27,840
types of clay that He can make,
vessels of honor, vessels for
396
00:19:27,840 --> 00:19:31,520
common use, vessels of wrath,
vessels of mercy.
397
00:19:32,360 --> 00:19:36,560
God's the Potter and he is
making these vessels.
398
00:19:36,840 --> 00:19:39,560
And I think Joel did a good job.
Like they're definitely verses
399
00:19:39,560 --> 00:19:42,200
that talk about our
responsibility, our sinful
400
00:19:42,200 --> 00:19:46,200
nature, our desire to be our own
ruler.
401
00:19:46,280 --> 00:19:49,520
Those are in the Bible too.
And when we get to those, we
402
00:19:49,520 --> 00:19:52,240
preach those, we teach those.
But right now we're in Romans 9.
403
00:19:52,840 --> 00:19:55,840
This is big untrans sovereignty.
And so that's what we're doing.
404
00:19:55,840 --> 00:20:01,480
We're preaching and and teaching
those God makes those vessels so
405
00:20:01,480 --> 00:20:03,920
that he can demonstrate himself
to us.
406
00:20:03,920 --> 00:20:08,080
It's like, how do we know he's
merciful if we don't know he's
407
00:20:08,080 --> 00:20:10,480
also just?
How do we know he's just if he's
408
00:20:10,480 --> 00:20:12,720
not also merciful?
I think I think that that's
409
00:20:12,760 --> 00:20:15,320
good.
It's what's at stake is God's
410
00:20:15,320 --> 00:20:16,880
glory and God is all these
things.
411
00:20:16,880 --> 00:20:19,760
He hates sin, he's just, he's
perfect, but he's also loving,
412
00:20:19,760 --> 00:20:21,760
merciful, gracious and kind.
He's all of these things.
413
00:20:21,760 --> 00:20:25,760
And this is how we see he
displays, he's chosen to display
414
00:20:26,160 --> 00:20:28,360
his glory.
It's the same kind of thinking,
415
00:20:28,360 --> 00:20:30,800
I think when it comes to
something like the atonement.
416
00:20:31,040 --> 00:20:34,560
Everyone wants to emphasize, you
know, God, God loves you, but
417
00:20:34,560 --> 00:20:37,720
they don't want to emphasize
that there was a price to pay,
418
00:20:37,760 --> 00:20:39,200
right?
And it's like it's all these
419
00:20:39,200 --> 00:20:41,680
things.
It's not balanced and we might
420
00:20:41,680 --> 00:20:44,800
not understand it why it has to
be done this way to its fullest
421
00:20:44,800 --> 00:20:48,400
extent, but man, God is I like
this.
422
00:20:48,400 --> 00:20:50,840
You have this in the notes,
Michael, the just justifier.
423
00:20:50,840 --> 00:20:52,320
I almost.
Screamed that out.
424
00:20:52,680 --> 00:20:56,480
I was like, should I pull a Jack
here and and yell out the just
425
00:20:56,480 --> 00:20:58,800
justifier?
But that's what was ringing
426
00:20:58,800 --> 00:21:00,640
because that's what he's
demonstrating.
427
00:21:00,880 --> 00:21:05,160
I'm just I'm wrathful.
I take sin seriously.
428
00:21:05,640 --> 00:21:11,000
At the same time, I provided a
way for you, I, I can justify
429
00:21:11,000 --> 00:21:14,640
you because of that.
So it's those two natures of of
430
00:21:14,720 --> 00:21:16,280
himself that he's revealing to
us.
431
00:21:16,280 --> 00:21:19,000
And that, that's so good to keep
keep that in mind.
432
00:21:19,000 --> 00:21:22,360
And at the end of the day, you
know, you can read this text
433
00:21:22,400 --> 00:21:26,000
with God's glory in mind.
You can read this text with me
434
00:21:26,000 --> 00:21:27,960
in mind.
And, you know, getting that
435
00:21:27,960 --> 00:21:31,440
focus on him, I think helps
clarify everything else.
436
00:21:31,440 --> 00:21:33,960
And, and this is the part of the
show where Michael sings a song.
437
00:21:35,200 --> 00:21:37,360
Yeah, because he had in here.
It's ultimately about God and
438
00:21:37,360 --> 00:21:39,760
his glory, and it's about him,
not us.
439
00:21:39,760 --> 00:21:43,680
And have you seen this parody
song where this guy sings It's
440
00:21:43,680 --> 00:21:48,520
all about me for my glory and my
fame, You know, taking the
441
00:21:49,040 --> 00:21:52,280
taking the song that that was
originally written.
442
00:21:52,280 --> 00:21:54,600
It's all about you.
That feels great.
443
00:21:54,800 --> 00:21:55,920
But it's all about me.
Yeah.
444
00:21:55,960 --> 00:21:59,240
Yeah, nice.
And and also not only the part
445
00:21:59,240 --> 00:22:01,080
of the podcast where we're
seeing, but it's the part of the
446
00:22:01,080 --> 00:22:02,680
podcast where we go to the
Puritans.
447
00:22:03,000 --> 00:22:04,480
That's right.
Jonathan Edwards, pastor.
448
00:22:04,480 --> 00:22:06,720
Jill's getting the heavy hitters
out.
449
00:22:06,720 --> 00:22:09,600
You know you're getting into
some deep, deep theology.
450
00:22:10,200 --> 00:22:13,360
Jonathan Edwards has this
extended quote that Pedro quotes
451
00:22:13,600 --> 00:22:15,920
he writes.
It's a proper and excellent
452
00:22:15,920 --> 00:22:18,920
thing for infinite glory to
shine forth.
453
00:22:19,160 --> 00:22:21,840
For the same reason it's proper
that the shining 4th of God's
454
00:22:21,840 --> 00:22:26,040
glory should be complete, that
is, that all parts of his glory
455
00:22:26,040 --> 00:22:29,400
should shine forth, that every
beauty should be proportionally
456
00:22:29,800 --> 00:22:33,840
radiance, that the beholder may
have a proper notion of God.
457
00:22:34,440 --> 00:22:37,560
It's not proper that one glory
should be exceedingly manifested
458
00:22:37,560 --> 00:22:41,400
in another nut so evil is
necessary in order to the
459
00:22:41,400 --> 00:22:44,040
highest happiness of the
creature and the completeness of
460
00:22:44,040 --> 00:22:46,280
that communication of God for
which he made the world.
461
00:22:46,680 --> 00:22:50,720
Because the creatures happiness
consists in the knowledge of God
462
00:22:51,240 --> 00:22:53,120
and the sense of his love.
And if the knowledge of him be
463
00:22:53,120 --> 00:22:57,160
imperfect, the happiness of the
creature must be proportionately
464
00:22:57,480 --> 00:22:59,280
imperfect.
That if we don't see the full
465
00:22:59,280 --> 00:23:03,640
picture of God, we we're not.
We can't glory in God, be as
466
00:23:03,640 --> 00:23:06,160
happy in God, because we we
don't understand His full
467
00:23:06,360 --> 00:23:08,000
character.
That's right.
468
00:23:08,200 --> 00:23:11,960
That's, I think that's right on
all right, Application Part 2.
469
00:23:12,040 --> 00:23:15,640
So now we're taking verses 24
through 29 and really Paul's
470
00:23:15,640 --> 00:23:19,040
going to turn to the Old
Testament and show support of
471
00:23:19,040 --> 00:23:24,280
God being merciful in caring,
caring for and caring through
472
00:23:24,280 --> 00:23:28,960
this remnant of Jews.
So it starts out, even us whom
473
00:23:29,360 --> 00:23:34,120
he also called, not from among
Jews only, but also from among
474
00:23:34,120 --> 00:23:38,880
Gentiles, as he says in Hosea.
I will call those who are not my
475
00:23:38,880 --> 00:23:42,920
people, my people, and her who
is not beloved, beloved.
476
00:23:43,080 --> 00:23:46,320
And it shall be that in the
place where it was said to them,
477
00:23:46,640 --> 00:23:50,120
You are not my people, there
they shall be called sons of the
478
00:23:50,120 --> 00:23:52,680
living God.
Isaiah cries out concerning
479
00:23:52,680 --> 00:23:54,400
Israel.
Though the number of the sons of
480
00:23:54,400 --> 00:23:57,800
Israel be like the sand of the
sea, it is the remnant that will
481
00:23:57,800 --> 00:24:01,000
be saved, for the Lord will
execute His word on the earth
482
00:24:01,160 --> 00:24:04,920
thoroughly and quickly.
And just as Isaiah foretold,
483
00:24:05,000 --> 00:24:09,320
unless the Lord of the of
Sabbath had left us to a
484
00:24:09,320 --> 00:24:12,680
posterity, we would have become
like Sodom and would have
485
00:24:12,680 --> 00:24:16,120
resembled Gomorrah.
So even in the Old Testament,
486
00:24:16,600 --> 00:24:21,120
God is preserving His people and
others Speaking of Him, calling
487
00:24:21,120 --> 00:24:23,880
out a new people for himself out
of the Gentiles.
488
00:24:24,040 --> 00:24:27,040
Yeah, I think that's pretty
striking that we would have been
489
00:24:27,040 --> 00:24:30,040
like Sodom and Gomorrah without
without you, but got in his
490
00:24:30,040 --> 00:24:35,680
mercy, pulled out a remnant.
Moving on to the conclusion,
491
00:24:36,360 --> 00:24:40,440
verses 30 through 33, Paul
starts to starts to wrap, wrap
492
00:24:40,440 --> 00:24:43,040
up some of his arguments.
He says, what shall we say then?
493
00:24:43,520 --> 00:24:46,440
The Gentiles who didn't pursue
righteousness attained
494
00:24:46,440 --> 00:24:49,640
righteousness, even the
righteousness which is by faith.
495
00:24:50,160 --> 00:24:53,960
But Israel pursuing a law of
righteousness did not arrive at
496
00:24:53,960 --> 00:24:55,960
the law, at that law.
Why?
497
00:24:56,520 --> 00:24:59,720
Because they didn't pursue it by
faith, but as though it were by
498
00:24:59,720 --> 00:25:02,080
works.
They stumbled over the stumbling
499
00:25:02,080 --> 00:25:06,400
stone, just as it's written.
Behold, I lay in Zion a stone of
500
00:25:06,400 --> 00:25:10,160
stumbling and a rock of offense.
And he who believes in him will
501
00:25:10,160 --> 00:25:13,360
not be disappointed.
I'll make a note before I kick
502
00:25:13,360 --> 00:25:15,960
it to you, Michael.
But what I love about Paul as
503
00:25:15,960 --> 00:25:20,520
he's dealing with this, you
know, theodicy that this problem
504
00:25:20,520 --> 00:25:23,520
trying to vindicate God's
righteousness about Jewish
505
00:25:23,520 --> 00:25:27,200
people specifically, he's just
layering and Jewish after text.
506
00:25:27,240 --> 00:25:29,240
He's just Old Testaments in here
a lot.
507
00:25:29,240 --> 00:25:32,160
He's like trying to show no,
God's word hasn't failed and
508
00:25:32,160 --> 00:25:34,440
this is what the God of the Jews
has said.
509
00:25:34,840 --> 00:25:38,760
No, that's good.
Joel a couple times went to the
510
00:25:38,760 --> 00:25:42,360
message.
So here's that same passage that
511
00:25:42,360 --> 00:25:45,960
Zach just read out of.
Is it Peterson's message?
512
00:25:46,320 --> 00:25:48,480
Yeah, he says.
How can we sum this up?
513
00:25:48,480 --> 00:25:51,560
All those who didn't seem
interested in what God was doing
514
00:25:51,560 --> 00:25:54,400
actually embraced what God was
doing as he straightened out
515
00:25:54,400 --> 00:25:57,160
their lives.
And Israel, who seemed so
516
00:25:57,160 --> 00:25:59,600
interested in reading and
talking about what God was
517
00:25:59,600 --> 00:26:01,920
doing, missed it.
How could they miss it?
518
00:26:02,280 --> 00:26:05,560
Because instead of trusting God,
they took over.
519
00:26:05,840 --> 00:26:08,600
They are absorbed in what they
themselves were doing.
520
00:26:08,800 --> 00:26:11,560
They are absorbed in their God
projects.
521
00:26:11,560 --> 00:26:15,040
In scare quotes that they didn't
notice God right in front of
522
00:26:15,040 --> 00:26:17,360
them, like a huge rock in the
middle of the road.
523
00:26:17,600 --> 00:26:20,040
And so they stumbled into him
and went sprawling.
524
00:26:20,320 --> 00:26:23,720
Isaiah again gives us a metaphor
for pulling this together.
525
00:26:23,720 --> 00:26:27,680
Careful, I put a huge stone on
the road to Mount Zion, a stone
526
00:26:27,680 --> 00:26:30,680
you can't get around.
But the stone is me.
527
00:26:30,840 --> 00:26:34,720
If you're looking for me, you'll
find me on the way, not in the
528
00:26:34,720 --> 00:26:36,960
way.
Yeah, We find this kind of thing
529
00:26:36,960 --> 00:26:38,480
quoted a lot in the New
Testament.
530
00:26:38,480 --> 00:26:40,280
I feel like this stumbling
stone.
531
00:26:40,280 --> 00:26:43,560
Yeah, yeah.
That this imagery that you know,
532
00:26:43,560 --> 00:26:46,160
that the Jews missed it and and
Jesus was, was right there
533
00:26:46,160 --> 00:26:49,000
stumbling over him because, you
know, focused on, on works and
534
00:26:49,000 --> 00:26:52,480
not by faith in the Messiah who
was right there.
535
00:26:52,640 --> 00:26:55,520
Yeah, and Joel's like he could
either be a stumbling stone or
536
00:26:55,520 --> 00:26:57,120
stepping stone.
Yeah, that, that's.
537
00:26:57,160 --> 00:26:59,200
Good.
That's a good, good turn of a
538
00:26:59,200 --> 00:27:03,480
phrase there because if you
recognize God for whom Jesus,
539
00:27:03,480 --> 00:27:06,280
for whom he is, you recognize
yourself for who you are after
540
00:27:06,280 --> 00:27:09,120
you let the law really be the
tutor that it's meant to be to
541
00:27:09,120 --> 00:27:12,120
show you, you know what, you're
not going to keep the law.
542
00:27:12,400 --> 00:27:14,000
You're going to daily break the
law.
543
00:27:14,000 --> 00:27:18,920
You're going to, you know, daily
need some type of sacrifice.
544
00:27:18,920 --> 00:27:21,640
You're not ever, you know,
you're go back to the Sermon on
545
00:27:21,640 --> 00:27:23,400
the Mount.
Your righteousness is not going
546
00:27:23,400 --> 00:27:24,840
to exceed that of the scribes or
Pharisees.
547
00:27:24,840 --> 00:27:27,320
You're not going to be perfect
as your Father in heaven is.
548
00:27:28,000 --> 00:27:30,680
And so now you can go, OK, I
need help.
549
00:27:30,800 --> 00:27:32,840
And then that's where the stone
comes in, stepping up.
550
00:27:33,200 --> 00:27:36,280
Absolutely.
And so I think as we end Romans
551
00:27:36,280 --> 00:27:38,600
9, it's good just to consider
this whole flow of
552
00:27:38,600 --> 00:27:41,760
argumentation.
Has the word of God fail?
553
00:27:41,760 --> 00:27:44,440
You know, is God fair?
God, That can't be right.
554
00:27:44,720 --> 00:27:47,320
And then as we get into chapter
10, we look a little bit more at
555
00:27:47,320 --> 00:27:51,280
the means God uses because I
think the accusation, you know,
556
00:27:51,280 --> 00:27:55,120
levied hard against people who
are big on sovereignty of God is
557
00:27:55,520 --> 00:27:57,800
and I guess you don't witness.
And it's like, Oh well, chapter
558
00:27:57,800 --> 00:28:00,880
10's a lot about the means and
witnessing specifically.
559
00:28:00,880 --> 00:28:03,600
So it's like, you know, I think
those things are together in
560
00:28:03,600 --> 00:28:05,760
Paul's argument for for a
specific reason, right?
561
00:28:05,760 --> 00:28:08,440
Because these things, you know,
really complement each other.
562
00:28:08,600 --> 00:28:12,440
Yeah, if if you are as someone
who I've defined as a hyper
563
00:28:12,440 --> 00:28:15,120
Calvinist, then then you're not
taking the full counsel, the
564
00:28:15,120 --> 00:28:16,520
word, because we're still to
pray.
565
00:28:16,800 --> 00:28:19,600
We're still to witness because
we don't, you know, we don't
566
00:28:19,600 --> 00:28:23,600
know how God even uses those in
his, that's right, His sovereign
567
00:28:23,600 --> 00:28:25,560
plan.
So, you know, we're, we're
568
00:28:25,560 --> 00:28:30,040
supposed to be about that.
So application #1 he who
569
00:28:30,040 --> 00:28:35,080
believes in God will not be
disappointed.
570
00:28:35,760 --> 00:28:39,480
And he gave this illustration of
this kid who gives his mom this
571
00:28:39,480 --> 00:28:42,600
face mask for Christmas is like,
hey, mom, this face mask is
572
00:28:42,600 --> 00:28:44,480
supposed to make you pretty.
Put it on right now.
573
00:28:44,480 --> 00:28:45,800
And she puts it on, takes it
off.
574
00:28:45,800 --> 00:28:49,960
It's like didn't work.
Yeah, that, that that's so good.
575
00:28:49,960 --> 00:28:53,840
So by contrast, you believe in,
in Christ, your faith is in
576
00:28:53,840 --> 00:28:54,880
Christ.
You're a child of God.
577
00:28:54,880 --> 00:28:56,920
You you're not going to be
disappointed, even if that means
578
00:28:56,920 --> 00:29:00,360
you don't understand everything
totally that that's part of
579
00:29:00,360 --> 00:29:02,800
faith too, right?
That you will not be
580
00:29:02,800 --> 00:29:05,560
disappointed that that's a
that's a great first application
581
00:29:06,520 --> 00:29:09,640
because, you know, I think that
that is that emotional side.
582
00:29:09,640 --> 00:29:12,600
You just don't understand, you
know, man, why is people close
583
00:29:12,600 --> 00:29:13,320
to me?
Why?
584
00:29:13,320 --> 00:29:14,960
Why is this not working out how
I would hope?
585
00:29:15,520 --> 00:29:18,160
Yeah, and if you find yourself
in that place of disappointment,
586
00:29:18,200 --> 00:29:20,680
you know, I would just say go
back to Scripture like Ephesians
587
00:29:20,680 --> 00:29:24,400
one, all that we have in Christ,
Romans 8, which we just read
588
00:29:24,400 --> 00:29:26,080
about, you know, all creations
groaning.
589
00:29:26,240 --> 00:29:28,600
We don't ever, we don't
understand how we're supposed to
590
00:29:28,600 --> 00:29:30,800
pray necessarily.
Spirit is groaning on our
591
00:29:30,800 --> 00:29:33,040
behalf.
First Corinthians 15, we're
592
00:29:33,040 --> 00:29:34,440
going to get a new body.
We're going to get a
593
00:29:34,440 --> 00:29:36,160
resurrection body just like
Jesus.
594
00:29:36,560 --> 00:29:38,040
Revelation 20.
There's going to be a New
595
00:29:38,040 --> 00:29:39,640
Jerusalem.
We're going to be with him.
596
00:29:39,960 --> 00:29:42,280
You know, there's not going to
be even a need for a son because
597
00:29:42,280 --> 00:29:44,200
he's going to be our light, all
of our tears at light.
598
00:29:44,440 --> 00:29:49,240
So we have all of these promises
for this future hope and what
599
00:29:49,240 --> 00:29:53,040
God's done for us that we should
be able to go OK in the here and
600
00:29:53,040 --> 00:29:54,640
now.
I don't exactly understand what
601
00:29:54,640 --> 00:29:56,760
you're doing, God, but I'm, I'm
going to trust you.
602
00:29:56,760 --> 00:29:58,040
I'm not going to be disappointed
in you.
603
00:29:58,680 --> 00:30:02,960
So, so good application 2, you
know, thinking about divine
604
00:30:02,960 --> 00:30:05,040
sovereignty and human
responsibility.
605
00:30:05,040 --> 00:30:07,480
I think, you know, pastor girl
said it well, I'm going to
606
00:30:07,480 --> 00:30:09,040
preach what the text says.
There's another text that's
607
00:30:09,040 --> 00:30:10,520
going to talk about human
responsibility.
608
00:30:10,520 --> 00:30:15,920
I will preach that hard as well.
And I think people unfairly just
609
00:30:16,360 --> 00:30:18,600
put pigeonhole people into one,
one or the other.
610
00:30:18,600 --> 00:30:20,640
And it's like, why can't we have
both, right?
611
00:30:20,840 --> 00:30:23,440
You know, why can't we just
agree that Scripture speaks to
612
00:30:23,440 --> 00:30:25,840
both?
And maybe we can't totally in
613
00:30:25,840 --> 00:30:27,880
our minds reconcile everything
perfectly.
614
00:30:27,880 --> 00:30:32,560
This great quote by Ward Wersby
says no one will deny that there
615
00:30:32,560 --> 00:30:34,520
are many mysteries that
connected with divine
616
00:30:34,520 --> 00:30:37,160
sovereignty and human
responsibility.
617
00:30:37,440 --> 00:30:40,120
Nowhere does God ask us to
choose between these two truths
618
00:30:40,240 --> 00:30:43,120
because they both come from God
and are part of God's plan.
619
00:30:43,560 --> 00:30:45,480
They do not compete, they
cooperate.
620
00:30:46,080 --> 00:30:49,000
The fact that we cannot fully
understand how they work
621
00:30:49,000 --> 00:30:51,880
together doesn't deny the fact
that they do.
622
00:30:52,040 --> 00:30:54,440
When a man asked Charles
Spurgeon how he reconciled
623
00:30:54,440 --> 00:30:57,520
divine sovereignty and human
responsibility, Spurgeon
624
00:30:57,520 --> 00:31:00,480
replied, I never try to
reconcile friends.
625
00:31:00,800 --> 00:31:06,000
And so I, I, I think sometimes
you can be so focused on one of
626
00:31:06,000 --> 00:31:07,120
those, you can kind of minimize
it.
627
00:31:07,200 --> 00:31:09,400
It's a good, it's a good give
and take, a good balance.
628
00:31:09,400 --> 00:31:12,560
I think at the end of the day,
you just want to be anchored to
629
00:31:12,720 --> 00:31:15,120
some text and that and that
helps.
630
00:31:15,120 --> 00:31:18,240
But no one's saying your actions
don't matter.
631
00:31:18,640 --> 00:31:19,240
Right.
Yeah.
632
00:31:19,240 --> 00:31:22,360
And I think you have to be
faithful to the text.
633
00:31:22,360 --> 00:31:24,920
And then you got to find out,
you know, in your systematic
634
00:31:24,920 --> 00:31:28,800
theology, which everyone has,
whether they realize it or not,
635
00:31:29,120 --> 00:31:33,000
you have to figure out a way
that you can kind of be true to
636
00:31:33,000 --> 00:31:36,040
all these different texts, like
what way of understanding
637
00:31:36,040 --> 00:31:39,880
salvation or what way of
understanding who God is really
638
00:31:39,960 --> 00:31:43,040
can be faithful to all these
different texts and how we
639
00:31:43,040 --> 00:31:46,480
understand them.
And so, but yeah, there's,
640
00:31:46,560 --> 00:31:48,960
there's, there's texts out there
that talk about God's
641
00:31:48,960 --> 00:31:52,400
sovereignty, text that talks
about our responsibility.
642
00:31:52,400 --> 00:31:55,600
And you really should not
shouldn't be a A cause of
643
00:31:55,600 --> 00:31:59,200
argument because it's clearly
what scripture says.
644
00:31:59,680 --> 00:32:01,520
Right, right there.
It's in the Bible.
645
00:32:01,520 --> 00:32:03,640
That's why we believe in the
sovereignty of God.
646
00:32:04,400 --> 00:32:06,920
People can get bogged down.
It's not these are important
647
00:32:06,920 --> 00:32:10,440
truths, but you can really get
bogged down and not and be
648
00:32:10,440 --> 00:32:14,080
talking past each other.
And then kind of that concluding
649
00:32:14,400 --> 00:32:17,600
passage that Paul mentioned
that, you know, Christ is a
650
00:32:17,600 --> 00:32:19,800
stumbling stone, but you're not
not for us.
651
00:32:19,800 --> 00:32:24,800
If you have faith, faith in
Christ, you can rest, rest in
652
00:32:24,800 --> 00:32:27,600
this truth and not and not be
like the Jews that were, you
653
00:32:27,600 --> 00:32:29,720
know, just trying to work it out
on their own.
654
00:32:31,040 --> 00:32:33,880
Then we looked at Communion
because we took communion today
655
00:32:34,000 --> 00:32:39,520
and, you know, his blood
inaugurated the new Covenant.
656
00:32:40,000 --> 00:32:42,600
And I don't you're, you're not a
big movie guy, so I'm gonna make
657
00:32:42,600 --> 00:32:44,960
a reference.
You may or may not see How to
658
00:32:44,960 --> 00:32:46,000
Train a Dragon.
Have you seen?
659
00:32:46,160 --> 00:32:47,240
That I have not.
I've heard it's good.
660
00:32:48,120 --> 00:32:51,520
So like in that, in that movie,
in the second movie in all the
661
00:32:51,520 --> 00:32:54,240
series, like there's the main
character Hiccup, he'll always
662
00:32:54,240 --> 00:32:57,480
say stuff like they'll find
something out that's new or, and
663
00:32:57,480 --> 00:33:00,160
he'll say this changes
everything.
664
00:33:00,600 --> 00:33:03,760
I was like, that's we need to
take that clip from him saying
665
00:33:03,760 --> 00:33:06,960
that like married up with like
something like, you know, the
666
00:33:06,960 --> 00:33:08,920
blood of the covenant or Christ
resurrection.
667
00:33:08,920 --> 00:33:12,040
Like this changes everything.
And it should be a cause for us
668
00:33:12,040 --> 00:33:14,680
to rejoice in in who Christ is
and when He's done for us.
669
00:33:15,040 --> 00:33:17,640
Romans 9.
Romans 9 in the books In the
670
00:33:17,640 --> 00:33:20,080
books.
Moving on to to Romans 10.
671
00:33:20,960 --> 00:33:22,520
Still got a lot of lot of
romance to go.
672
00:33:22,520 --> 00:33:25,000
A lot of romance to go.
I can't wait till, you know, we
673
00:33:25,000 --> 00:33:27,360
get to that last chapter.
We'll get a lot of names in
674
00:33:27,360 --> 00:33:29,120
there.
That's right.
675
00:33:29,120 --> 00:33:30,760
You're getting Michael's whole
family in there.
676
00:33:30,760 --> 00:33:33,280
That's great.
Yeah, Phoebe and Julia are are
677
00:33:33,360 --> 00:33:34,360
in there I believe.
Wow.
678
00:33:34,800 --> 00:33:38,000
Pretty, pretty cool.
Any anything else you got
679
00:33:38,000 --> 00:33:40,320
Michael?
No, I, I'm good.
680
00:33:41,080 --> 00:33:45,800
Awesome, That's our take.
Thanks for listening to Take 2.
681
00:33:46,520 --> 00:33:49,120
Find us wherever you find
podcasts and on YouTube for
682
00:33:49,120 --> 00:33:50,840
those who want to watch our
video cast.
00:00:00,040 --> 00:00:03,480
All right, we are back.
We have stolen the mics back
2
00:00:03,480 --> 00:00:07,720
from the wives.
They are back in the, should we,
3
00:00:08,000 --> 00:00:09,600
I shouldn't say back in the
kitchen.
4
00:00:10,400 --> 00:00:13,640
That would be that would be.
But we love and cherish our
5
00:00:13,640 --> 00:00:17,160
wives.
Of course, but a little note for
6
00:00:17,400 --> 00:00:19,440
Leanne and Jill.
Just be careful what you say
7
00:00:19,440 --> 00:00:21,400
because the mics come back.
Right.
8
00:00:21,600 --> 00:00:26,400
They do come back and she did
tell, Jill told me that they're
9
00:00:26,400 --> 00:00:30,160
going to talk about the, their
engagement stories, which has
10
00:00:30,160 --> 00:00:33,840
always been a tough one for me.
And I, I, I thought she was
11
00:00:33,840 --> 00:00:35,240
going to make it worse than what
it was.
12
00:00:35,240 --> 00:00:37,760
But I appreciated, you know,
'cause I did have a plan.
13
00:00:38,280 --> 00:00:43,400
And then the, the Fernando
Ortega concert got cancelled.
14
00:00:43,800 --> 00:00:46,360
And then I was like, OK, we'll
come up with a different plan.
15
00:00:46,360 --> 00:00:48,680
And I was thinking about maybe
going out to there was like a
16
00:00:48,760 --> 00:00:51,960
Country Club, like with a gazebo
or something and proposing out
17
00:00:51,960 --> 00:00:53,960
there.
And then like we're driving
18
00:00:53,960 --> 00:00:56,080
down.
And it wasn't, it wasn't the
19
00:00:56,080 --> 00:01:01,080
actual ring thing that was in my
pocket, but it was like the
20
00:01:01,080 --> 00:01:03,080
cardboard box that the ring came
in.
21
00:01:03,080 --> 00:01:06,480
And I did not do a good job of
I, I thought I had it hidden,
22
00:01:06,520 --> 00:01:10,080
but apparently it wasn't hidden.
And then it was like just
23
00:01:10,080 --> 00:01:13,120
derailed from there.
So I was like, oh, everything
24
00:01:13,120 --> 00:01:15,760
was like unscripted.
But how many years have you ever
25
00:01:15,760 --> 00:01:19,000
married?
22 I.
26
00:01:19,320 --> 00:01:22,520
Was like oh I'm not trying to
help you dig a deep Rd. that was
27
00:01:22,520 --> 00:01:23,680
great but 20?
Two years later.
28
00:01:24,280 --> 00:01:27,840
We're going strong.
You go on duck hunts and things
29
00:01:27,840 --> 00:01:29,600
are good.
It's like that's that's a test
30
00:01:29,600 --> 00:01:31,760
of a strong marriage, you know?
So.
31
00:01:32,200 --> 00:01:35,880
Worked out, Yeah.
I was trying to think of of
32
00:01:35,880 --> 00:01:38,480
things Leanne, Leanne said on
there.
33
00:01:38,960 --> 00:01:42,320
There she said something about
me and the doorbell.
34
00:01:42,680 --> 00:01:44,080
What?
What did she say?
35
00:01:44,680 --> 00:01:47,720
Yeah, that that she the best
thing she got this little
36
00:01:47,720 --> 00:01:50,200
electronic doorbell and that you
don't like it when you're up
37
00:01:50,200 --> 00:01:51,560
there.
It always like scares you 'cause
38
00:01:51,560 --> 00:01:52,720
you're not used.
To too much too.
39
00:01:52,960 --> 00:01:55,440
It's actually a great idea.
But you know, honestly, I
40
00:01:55,440 --> 00:01:57,400
thought, I thought they'd.
We actually haven't aired their
41
00:01:57,400 --> 00:01:59,880
episode yet, but I'm assuming
yeah.
42
00:02:00,000 --> 00:02:02,440
We've heard it though.
Yeah, we've heard it, and you'll
43
00:02:02,440 --> 00:02:04,040
have heard it by the time you're
hearing this.
44
00:02:04,040 --> 00:02:06,000
Yeah, 'cause we're recording
this just a little bit early.
45
00:02:08,360 --> 00:02:12,960
One question Jill had 'cause she
had she your wife was talking
46
00:02:12,960 --> 00:02:16,960
about y'all's engagement and
walking along the beach, and
47
00:02:16,960 --> 00:02:22,320
then there was a blue light in
the sand, and the blue light was
48
00:02:22,320 --> 00:02:23,920
never explained like what it
was.
49
00:02:23,920 --> 00:02:27,400
Yeah, my memory might be failing
me, so Leanne can.
50
00:02:27,560 --> 00:02:28,520
How long have y'all been
married?
51
00:02:29,000 --> 00:02:34,720
Not 20 years to I wow, I think
12 years now that I'm on the
52
00:02:34,720 --> 00:02:37,560
mic, I'm losing 2012 twelve.
Yeah, yeah.
53
00:02:37,560 --> 00:02:41,120
So we we had a 12 year mark.
OK, so so we were what?
54
00:02:41,120 --> 00:02:43,280
What month were you all married?
August 11th.
55
00:02:43,280 --> 00:02:45,280
So we're exactly 10 years apart,
almost 'cause we were.
56
00:02:45,280 --> 00:02:49,400
August 4th, 2002.
August 11th, 2012.
57
00:02:49,400 --> 00:02:53,080
Wow, so you're saying what I'm
hearing is you got my back like
58
00:02:53,080 --> 00:02:55,640
your your anniversary comes
first, so if you guys are
59
00:02:55,640 --> 00:02:57,560
celebrating yours, I know all I
got to get on my game.
60
00:02:58,040 --> 00:03:02,520
But this blue light Leanne was
trying her best to just totally
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00:03:02,520 --> 00:03:05,120
ruin this engagement at every
every step she could
62
00:03:05,120 --> 00:03:07,440
unknowingly.
Like I had a message in a
63
00:03:07,440 --> 00:03:08,760
bottle.
She talked about it, but she was
64
00:03:08,760 --> 00:03:10,840
like, I don't wanna touch a
gross, gross bottle.
65
00:03:10,840 --> 00:03:12,240
Like, no, I'm like, maybe it's
not gross.
66
00:03:12,240 --> 00:03:15,200
Maybe it's really important you
wanna grab that Did it?
67
00:03:15,440 --> 00:03:18,200
I think the blue light might
have been maybe it was like
68
00:03:18,200 --> 00:03:20,360
marking like a spot, like I had
light.
69
00:03:20,360 --> 00:03:22,680
I had like a it was like old
school had a remote and then
70
00:03:22,680 --> 00:03:24,320
when I pressed it a bunch of
lights.
71
00:03:24,760 --> 00:03:29,400
But but I think I might have had
one already blinking or there so
72
00:03:29,400 --> 00:03:31,120
I knew where to go where
everything because I was on the
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00:03:31,120 --> 00:03:32,120
beach.
It was dark.
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00:03:32,920 --> 00:03:35,520
I'll tell you what too, just a
lot of extension cord going
75
00:03:35,520 --> 00:03:38,360
everywhere.
It was it was kind of crazy.
76
00:03:38,640 --> 00:03:42,480
I'll have to show pictures we.
Yeah, if you give me pictures.
77
00:03:42,480 --> 00:03:44,120
Oh, show up.
I could put them up here.
78
00:03:44,240 --> 00:03:46,640
It's like one of those the
camera like we didn't have like
79
00:03:46,640 --> 00:03:49,160
professional pictures taken in
the moment, but we had like,
80
00:03:49,840 --> 00:03:51,760
it's like, you know, like when
you take a picture in the dark
81
00:03:51,760 --> 00:03:54,680
and there's lights and the
lights are like running, like,
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00:03:54,760 --> 00:03:56,240
you know, moving.
There's a lot of that going on
83
00:03:56,240 --> 00:03:59,040
where it's kind of crazy, but
documentation that actually
84
00:03:59,040 --> 00:04:01,280
happened so.
Talking about trying to make
85
00:04:01,280 --> 00:04:06,240
things go awry unknowingly,
Chris had gotten some.
86
00:04:06,240 --> 00:04:08,040
Have you heard this story?
And he proposed Luana.
87
00:04:08,040 --> 00:04:10,560
I don't think I had.
He got some Cracker Jacks and he
88
00:04:10,560 --> 00:04:14,360
put the ring inside the little,
the little toy so that, you
89
00:04:14,360 --> 00:04:18,000
know, and, and when Luana got
it, she was about to throw it
90
00:04:18,000 --> 00:04:19,959
off the Cliff 'cause they're
always like, she's like, these
91
00:04:19,959 --> 00:04:22,320
are just cheap little toys.
And he's like, no, no, no.
92
00:04:22,800 --> 00:04:24,680
No, yeah, don't throw that one.
They crack.
93
00:04:24,680 --> 00:04:26,440
Do people still do Cracker Jack
boxes?
94
00:04:26,440 --> 00:04:28,640
Have they taken like they used
to be a thing when I was
95
00:04:28,640 --> 00:04:30,160
kidding?
I know they were like before
96
00:04:30,160 --> 00:04:31,760
that.
I haven't seen a Cracker Jack
97
00:04:31,760 --> 00:04:33,560
box in a minute.
I think you can maybe find them
98
00:04:33,560 --> 00:04:36,120
at Dollar General and and
Cracker Barrel or something like
99
00:04:36,120 --> 00:04:38,200
that, but they used to be big
everywhere.
100
00:04:38,200 --> 00:04:39,320
Yeah, it.
Used to be the thing but that
101
00:04:39,320 --> 00:04:42,680
that's smart.
Put the nice ring in there and
102
00:04:42,720 --> 00:04:45,280
just out that we'll have to ask
about that next, maybe next home
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00:04:45,280 --> 00:04:48,080
groups he can he can share that
engagement stories.
104
00:04:48,520 --> 00:04:50,640
If, if she had thrown that off,
Chris could have said that's not
105
00:04:50,640 --> 00:04:51,040
right.
I I.
106
00:04:51,360 --> 00:04:54,640
Was looking for what we did too.
So Michael beat me to the punch.
107
00:04:54,880 --> 00:04:58,960
Title of the sermon today.
The 28th sermon in Romans is
108
00:04:58,960 --> 00:05:00,720
God.
That's not right.
109
00:05:00,720 --> 00:05:05,360
Really this response that that
Paul is hypothetically, you
110
00:05:05,360 --> 00:05:07,920
know, raising and answering in
Romans 9.
111
00:05:08,120 --> 00:05:17,680
So let's go ahead and take it to
the next level from the hearts
112
00:05:17,760 --> 00:05:20,080
of the low country in South
Carolina.
113
00:05:21,080 --> 00:05:25,400
It's the Take Two podcast where
we take theology to the next
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00:05:25,400 --> 00:05:27,040
level.
Romans 9.
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00:05:27,160 --> 00:05:30,320
Romans 9 A tough.
One pastor's working his way
116
00:05:30,320 --> 00:05:34,360
through it really well.
And you know what, what pastor
117
00:05:34,360 --> 00:05:35,880
does well, he does several
things well.
118
00:05:36,280 --> 00:05:39,880
I think what he's done well in
this passage in particular is he
119
00:05:40,240 --> 00:05:43,720
has stuck so close to the text.
He's not doing a ton of these
120
00:05:43,720 --> 00:05:45,440
outside illustrations.
He's trying to use the text
121
00:05:45,440 --> 00:05:48,360
illustrations.
And on top of that, he was
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00:05:48,360 --> 00:05:50,760
doing, and he's staying in the,
he's really reviewing this
123
00:05:50,760 --> 00:05:53,040
context, which he will do.
But he did this really cool
124
00:05:53,040 --> 00:05:55,040
thing.
We got a couple of the younger
125
00:05:55,040 --> 00:05:58,560
children, like teenage, like
young adults, I don't know, like
126
00:05:58,560 --> 00:06:01,360
12:15.
Something 10. 12 Yeah, to
127
00:06:01,800 --> 00:06:03,960
actually participate.
In.
128
00:06:04,680 --> 00:06:07,920
An illustration those kids will
probably never forget Romans 9.
129
00:06:07,920 --> 00:06:09,920
That's right, that's right,
'cause he gave them some clay
130
00:06:09,920 --> 00:06:12,280
and said here, here, make
something with the clay.
131
00:06:12,280 --> 00:06:16,520
And one of them made a, a fairly
nice cross with the heart.
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00:06:16,520 --> 00:06:18,160
The other one, I'm not sure what
he was making.
133
00:06:18,480 --> 00:06:21,920
He he asked for some extension,
some extra time.
134
00:06:23,080 --> 00:06:24,560
It's good.
It's a good lesson in
135
00:06:24,560 --> 00:06:26,960
illustration.
Sometimes I struggle with
136
00:06:26,960 --> 00:06:29,360
illustrations.
I want to get the text right and
137
00:06:29,360 --> 00:06:31,080
I people have all sorts of
illustrations.
138
00:06:31,080 --> 00:06:33,360
Sometimes they can really drive
home a point or help you
139
00:06:33,360 --> 00:06:35,520
understand, but sometimes pick
and distract.
140
00:06:35,680 --> 00:06:38,080
If someone's not careful about
like tied, you're like, that's
141
00:06:38,080 --> 00:06:40,560
like the only thing I remember
or I can't tie it to the point
142
00:06:40,560 --> 00:06:43,280
or didn't really make the point.
It was kind of adjacent.
143
00:06:43,280 --> 00:06:46,800
It's kind of hard to weave in
like perfect ones, but it can't
144
00:06:46,800 --> 00:06:48,880
get more perfect than taking it
directly.
145
00:06:48,920 --> 00:06:50,320
From the test, no, that's good.
That's good.
146
00:06:50,320 --> 00:06:54,000
Often times when I'm teaching
it'll be the next day I'm like,
147
00:06:54,840 --> 00:06:57,920
oh, that would have been a
perfect way to illustrate that.
148
00:06:57,920 --> 00:07:01,400
And So what I've tried to do
now, especially if I'm teaching
149
00:07:01,400 --> 00:07:05,680
a sermon or something, I'll try
to maybe type it up a little bit
150
00:07:05,760 --> 00:07:09,200
a couple days ahead of time.
And that way because I'm, I, I'm
151
00:07:09,720 --> 00:07:12,120
generally busy enough that I'm
like on Saturday, if I'm
152
00:07:12,120 --> 00:07:14,800
preaching for Joel, like that's
the day I'm like trying to pull
153
00:07:14,800 --> 00:07:16,400
everything together.
And that really, you know, I
154
00:07:16,400 --> 00:07:18,200
think there's something that
your mind does kind of in the
155
00:07:18,200 --> 00:07:20,320
background.
Sometimes it it you think of
156
00:07:20,320 --> 00:07:21,880
things a day or two afterwards
you.
157
00:07:21,920 --> 00:07:23,520
Know that that that that that's
good.
158
00:07:24,680 --> 00:07:27,880
The kind of things we're
wrestling with today that Pastor
159
00:07:27,880 --> 00:07:31,000
Joel really helped explain are,
you know, this idea we're
160
00:07:31,000 --> 00:07:32,160
working our way through Romans
9.
161
00:07:32,160 --> 00:07:36,240
It's it's really not fair that
that God chose to extend mercy
162
00:07:36,240 --> 00:07:40,120
to some but not others.
And if that's how things go when
163
00:07:40,120 --> 00:07:43,280
God is sovereign, it's how is it
right that he holds people
164
00:07:43,280 --> 00:07:45,640
accountable?
He's got this quote by William
165
00:07:45,640 --> 00:07:47,480
McDonald.
It, you know, it's some ways it
166
00:07:47,480 --> 00:07:50,720
seems like we're all pawns on a
divine checkerboard.
167
00:07:50,720 --> 00:07:53,400
What agency do we have if this
is the case?
168
00:07:53,400 --> 00:07:55,480
So I think really good.
Questions.
169
00:07:55,560 --> 00:07:59,320
What checker game William
McDonald is playing that has
170
00:07:59,320 --> 00:08:00,600
pawns in it?
You know what I'm saying?
171
00:08:01,400 --> 00:08:04,160
That's what I was wondering, was
like pawns on the checkerboard
172
00:08:04,480 --> 00:08:05,960
OK?
Spoken like that.
173
00:08:06,080 --> 00:08:07,160
What what what?
What's your?
174
00:08:07,160 --> 00:08:08,840
What's the title?
Are you a chess coach?
175
00:08:08,840 --> 00:08:10,400
A chess sponsor?
Like what?
176
00:08:10,400 --> 00:08:12,120
Yeah, I get called both of
those.
177
00:08:12,160 --> 00:08:14,040
Yeah.
Chess coach, chess sponsor.
178
00:08:14,280 --> 00:08:17,840
Yeah, do.
Do do it all well, what we can
179
00:08:17,840 --> 00:08:20,720
jump into, It's so helpful.
Everyone just like takes a
180
00:08:20,720 --> 00:08:23,360
passage in Romans 9 and fights
about it, but it's like work
181
00:08:23,360 --> 00:08:25,920
your way back up to that context
and see the big picture.
182
00:08:25,920 --> 00:08:28,360
And then you kind of you kind of
get a lay of the land.
183
00:08:28,720 --> 00:08:31,160
Yeah, that's good.
And So what Joel has
184
00:08:31,160 --> 00:08:34,080
consistently done is taken us
back to the end of Chapter 8
185
00:08:34,280 --> 00:08:36,679
where we see this.
What has some have termed the
186
00:08:36,679 --> 00:08:42,840
golden chain of redemption.
It's kind of starts off in 828.
187
00:08:42,840 --> 00:08:45,920
And we know that God causes all
things to work together for good
188
00:08:45,920 --> 00:08:48,680
to those who love God, to those
who are called according to his
189
00:08:48,680 --> 00:08:50,120
purpose.
And then here it comes.
190
00:08:50,520 --> 00:08:53,680
For those whom he foreknew, he
also predestined to become
191
00:08:53,680 --> 00:08:56,880
conformed to the image of his
Son, so that he would be the
192
00:08:56,880 --> 00:09:00,000
first born among many brethren.
And those whom he predestined,
193
00:09:00,000 --> 00:09:02,440
he also called.
And these whom he called he also
194
00:09:02,440 --> 00:09:05,400
justified, and these whom he
justified he also glorified.
195
00:09:05,720 --> 00:09:09,480
Those are all past tense
Speaking of, you know, this past
196
00:09:09,560 --> 00:09:14,160
action that had ongoing effects.
But really you get that.
197
00:09:14,160 --> 00:09:16,960
And then you read the end where
it says nothing's going to
198
00:09:16,960 --> 00:09:18,360
separate us from the love of
God.
199
00:09:18,600 --> 00:09:22,160
Huge things.
But then someone might be going
200
00:09:22,160 --> 00:09:25,320
Paul, just look around you.
What's going on with the Jews?
201
00:09:25,320 --> 00:09:27,080
They're they're falling away.
They're not.
202
00:09:27,160 --> 00:09:29,800
Not all of them believe has Has
his promises failed.
203
00:09:30,320 --> 00:09:32,520
It's it's such, such a good
thing to consider because I
204
00:09:32,520 --> 00:09:35,320
think of myself and I think of
my brothers and sisters at
205
00:09:35,320 --> 00:09:39,040
Charleston Bible Church and my
view is most of these people
206
00:09:39,040 --> 00:09:40,760
have a relationship with God.
This is great.
207
00:09:41,000 --> 00:09:43,360
But Can you imagine being in a
context where you look around
208
00:09:43,360 --> 00:09:45,280
and you're like, man, good news
for me.
209
00:09:45,280 --> 00:09:49,680
Sure, But it's like, why has why
is this not worked out?
210
00:09:49,720 --> 00:09:52,400
You know, if Jews were God's
chosen people.
211
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So I think that that's good.
Just like you just mentioned
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that verse, verse 6, has the
glory to God failed.
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00:09:57,240 --> 00:09:59,160
It's it's keeping that in mind.
It hasn't failed.
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00:09:59,160 --> 00:10:01,280
And Paul, Paul's going on saying
This is why because God is
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sovereign, it has not failed.
We've got this quote we've
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00:10:04,440 --> 00:10:07,200
mentioned a few times by Douglas
Moo.
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00:10:07,200 --> 00:10:10,400
If God's plan depended on the
vagaries of sinful human beings
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00:10:10,400 --> 00:10:13,520
for its continuance, then indeed
God's word were to fall into the
219
00:10:13,520 --> 00:10:16,480
ground long ago.
But God's purpose and history is
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fulfilled because he himself
elects people to be part of that
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00:10:20,160 --> 00:10:23,920
purpose that it all hinges on
God hinges on me, man.
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00:10:23,920 --> 00:10:28,320
I do a lot of things good.
I do far more things bad or drop
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the ball or miss something,
yeah.
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Yeah.
So this section, last sermon and
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this sermon are what could be
formally called a diatribe.
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00:10:37,000 --> 00:10:39,520
We use that word a lot of times.
Oh, that person just went on
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00:10:39,520 --> 00:10:44,240
diatribe like this is the formal
and Webster and Marian actually
228
00:10:44,240 --> 00:10:50,440
call it the archaic definition,
but it's a prolonged discourse.
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00:10:50,440 --> 00:10:53,840
But we're going to see Paul
engaged in a prolonged discourse
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against these hypothetical
objectors.
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00:10:56,400 --> 00:10:58,080
And that's what we covered last
week.
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You know, it's not fair.
And in what the question is, if
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God has mercy on some but
doesn't have mercy on all, then
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we don't think that's fair.
And then what we're going to
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look at today is that God is
going to, you know, if that's
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the case, then how can he hold
us accountable?
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00:11:18,680 --> 00:11:20,400
And so we would say that's not
right, God.
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Yeah, that that's the objection
Paul is anticipating.
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00:11:23,680 --> 00:11:25,960
Who can resist his will?
How can God find fault?
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00:11:25,960 --> 00:11:29,480
How can God be just all this?
All these thoughts are running
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00:11:29,720 --> 00:11:35,880
through the Paul.
Paul and maybe his people is
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like these Jews that they're
mind.
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00:11:37,400 --> 00:11:40,120
And so here's the answer up
front, you know, doesn't the
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00:11:40,120 --> 00:11:43,920
Potter have right over the clay
to make from the same lump 1
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00:11:43,920 --> 00:11:47,440
vessel for honorable use and
another for common use.
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00:11:47,440 --> 00:11:50,560
So that's the answer.
We'll go ahead and develop it
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00:11:51,520 --> 00:11:54,960
because it, it is a hard, it is
emotional thing for, you know,
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what fairness actually is versus
what we want.
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00:11:58,000 --> 00:12:02,160
Yeah, I, I think, 'cause when I
talk with people and I've said,
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well, God could send us all to
hell.
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Yeah, he could.
And that would be fine.
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00:12:06,640 --> 00:12:10,960
Or God could send everyone to
heaven and that would be fine.
253
00:12:11,600 --> 00:12:16,240
Or I think that they that they
would want it to depend on the
254
00:12:16,240 --> 00:12:18,800
person, but the person is making
the difference.
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00:12:18,800 --> 00:12:22,400
The person is deciding, OK, I
want to choose God because those
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00:12:22,400 --> 00:12:26,160
all seem OK with us.
Either, you know, universalism,
257
00:12:26,240 --> 00:12:29,760
everyone gets saved.
I don't know what the name is.
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00:12:29,760 --> 00:12:32,120
If we all go to hell, universal
justice.
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00:12:32,160 --> 00:12:34,520
I don't know.
Yeah, we don't really want that,
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00:12:34,520 --> 00:12:37,920
but we'd say it's fair.
Or if, hey, God kind of brings.
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00:12:37,920 --> 00:12:40,320
And I think this is what the
typical Armenian does, Everyone,
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00:12:40,360 --> 00:12:43,280
God brings everyone kind of up
to the same level.
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00:12:43,600 --> 00:12:46,240
And then they decide, you know,
it depends on the personal.
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00:12:46,240 --> 00:12:49,720
The Bible explicitly says it
does not depend on the man that
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00:12:49,720 --> 00:12:52,600
runs, but it depends on God.
And that's what people are
266
00:12:52,600 --> 00:12:54,920
uncomfortable with.
It, it's very uncomfortable,
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00:12:54,920 --> 00:12:57,720
even even if I know Scripture to
see something, it's just
268
00:12:57,720 --> 00:13:00,800
something in you.
Like I think pastor as he was
269
00:13:00,800 --> 00:13:03,440
talking through it, like maybe
struggle's not the right word.
270
00:13:03,440 --> 00:13:05,400
Maybe it is, but it's something
that you have any you're like,
271
00:13:05,480 --> 00:13:08,120
but we, you know, submit to the
word of God.
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00:13:08,120 --> 00:13:12,160
So looking ahead at this
passage, Paul in verse 19 starts
273
00:13:12,360 --> 00:13:16,360
with the criticism that we
mentioned in verses 20 to 21.
274
00:13:16,360 --> 00:13:21,040
We'll bring an illustration and
then the rest of the passage, 22
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00:13:21,040 --> 00:13:23,160
through 29.
He gives a little application,
276
00:13:23,720 --> 00:13:27,160
then wraps up a conclusion,
quotes some Old Testament text.
277
00:13:27,520 --> 00:13:31,320
So we'll go ahead and work our
way through this, starting with
278
00:13:31,320 --> 00:13:35,760
that criticism in verse 19.
Yeah, so this is verse 19.
279
00:13:35,760 --> 00:13:38,520
We're actually going to back up
to verse 18, it says.
280
00:13:38,520 --> 00:13:42,360
So then he has mercy on whom he
desires, and he hardens whom he
281
00:13:42,360 --> 00:13:44,680
desires.
Who will say to me that why does
282
00:13:44,680 --> 00:13:47,920
he still find fault?
For who can resist his will or
283
00:13:47,920 --> 00:13:50,840
who resists his will?
Slipped into a different
284
00:13:51,040 --> 00:13:52,440
translation there that I had
memorized.
285
00:13:53,040 --> 00:13:57,680
We got a few few translations up
here and, and you read something
286
00:13:57,680 --> 00:14:01,280
like that and you get this idea
that, man, everything is rigged
287
00:14:01,280 --> 00:14:02,600
against us.
It's like what?
288
00:14:02,760 --> 00:14:05,000
How can you find fault?
Like if this is how it goes
289
00:14:05,000 --> 00:14:07,840
down, what can we do?
We mentioned pawns on a
290
00:14:07,840 --> 00:14:11,120
checkerboard and NLTS
translation.
291
00:14:11,120 --> 00:14:13,400
I like this as well.
Then you might say, why does God
292
00:14:13,400 --> 00:14:16,440
blame people for not responding?
Haven't they simply done what he
293
00:14:16,440 --> 00:14:18,520
makes them to do?
But I think this probably is the
294
00:14:18,520 --> 00:14:21,920
natural response.
And I think if I were answering
295
00:14:21,920 --> 00:14:24,520
this and not Paul, because
Paul's going to answer it
296
00:14:24,560 --> 00:14:28,040
clearly his way, I would go, OK,
well, let's go back to Adam.
297
00:14:28,520 --> 00:14:32,560
Adam was our, you can either say
he's our federal head or we were
298
00:14:32,560 --> 00:14:37,000
in him, like in a genetic
genealogical sense.
299
00:14:37,600 --> 00:14:39,680
And Adam sinned on behalf of all
of us.
300
00:14:40,120 --> 00:14:43,520
So we all sin, we all have
original sin, we're all guilty,
301
00:14:43,520 --> 00:14:47,160
we're all going our own way.
He punched all of us over this
302
00:14:47,160 --> 00:14:51,200
Cliff, and now we're all running
away from God, and God chooses
303
00:14:51,200 --> 00:14:55,080
to mercy some.
But Paul's answer is a little
304
00:14:55,080 --> 00:14:58,600
bit yeah, more punchy than.
Mine, it's very punchy and he
305
00:14:58,600 --> 00:15:00,040
just he doesn't beat around the
Bush.
306
00:15:00,040 --> 00:15:03,800
He gets right to the point.
I'm in verse 20 and 21 he says
307
00:15:03,920 --> 00:15:08,000
On the contrary, who are you, O
man who answers back to God?
308
00:15:08,320 --> 00:15:11,280
The thing molded will not say to
the molder, why'd you make me
309
00:15:11,280 --> 00:15:12,240
like this?
Will it?
310
00:15:12,720 --> 00:15:15,720
Or does the Potter have a right
over the clay to make from the
311
00:15:15,720 --> 00:15:20,120
same lump 1 vessel for honorable
use and another for common use?
312
00:15:20,280 --> 00:15:22,840
Basically, he's just going right
at this creator creature
313
00:15:22,840 --> 00:15:26,240
distinction that you're not like
God, your perspectives not like
314
00:15:26,240 --> 00:15:27,200
God.
Like how?
315
00:15:27,200 --> 00:15:29,560
Almost.
Yeah, how dare you like even
316
00:15:29,720 --> 00:15:32,840
even question in this tone.
You know what?
317
00:15:32,840 --> 00:15:36,200
What has got to do?
Yeah, because I, I can, I think
318
00:15:36,200 --> 00:15:38,600
we can all sympathize with the
concern.
319
00:15:39,000 --> 00:15:41,160
Yeah.
And Paul's going to be like,
320
00:15:41,160 --> 00:15:44,840
yeah, not I'm not really even
going to answer that because
321
00:15:44,840 --> 00:15:47,440
you're thinking the wrong way.
You're you're you're coming at
322
00:15:47,440 --> 00:15:48,000
this the wrong way.
He's.
323
00:15:48,000 --> 00:15:49,960
Just coming.
Yeah, I, I and I think he's just
324
00:15:49,960 --> 00:15:52,080
cutting it off right there on
the message.
325
00:15:52,720 --> 00:15:55,600
Says it this way.
And this really kind of maybe
326
00:15:55,600 --> 00:15:57,280
brings a little bit of flavor to
it.
327
00:15:57,560 --> 00:15:59,880
Who in the world do you think
you are to second guess God?
328
00:16:00,240 --> 00:16:03,760
Do you for one moment suppose
any of us know enough to call
329
00:16:03,760 --> 00:16:06,320
call God into question?
Clay doesn't talk back to the
330
00:16:06,320 --> 00:16:09,200
fingers that mold it, saying,
why'd you shape me like this?
331
00:16:09,600 --> 00:16:12,560
Isn't that obvious that a Potter
has a perfect right to shape 1
332
00:16:12,560 --> 00:16:16,120
Olympic clay into a vase for
holding flowers and another into
333
00:16:16,120 --> 00:16:18,920
a pot for cooking beans?
If God needs one style of
334
00:16:18,920 --> 00:16:21,520
pottery especially designed to
show his angry displeasure and
335
00:16:21,720 --> 00:16:24,560
another style carefully crafted
the show His glorious goodness,
336
00:16:25,120 --> 00:16:28,200
isn't that all right?
I like the Liberty's take with
337
00:16:28,200 --> 00:16:30,360
the message for the with the
evasive flowers with the cook.
338
00:16:30,360 --> 00:16:33,040
It's like different purposes.
And you know, we don't, you
339
00:16:33,040 --> 00:16:36,040
know, get mad at these, you
know, people who produce these
340
00:16:36,040 --> 00:16:37,720
different types of pottery and
this kind of thing.
341
00:16:38,080 --> 00:16:41,120
It's a it's a good argument.
Like you're saying, man, it's
342
00:16:41,120 --> 00:16:43,160
hard, hard.
It just hit pudges you in the
343
00:16:43,160 --> 00:16:44,120
face.
Yeah.
344
00:16:44,120 --> 00:16:48,480
And I, I have often prayed and
I, I would encourage you if you
345
00:16:48,680 --> 00:16:52,560
are a parent or you have loved
ones who you're praying for, I,
346
00:16:52,560 --> 00:16:55,800
I pray God, I ask you to make
them a vessel of honor.
347
00:16:56,480 --> 00:16:57,840
Like that's what my prayer is
for.
348
00:16:58,040 --> 00:17:03,040
It's been, I think the God of
eternity hears those prayers and
349
00:17:03,160 --> 00:17:06,800
you know, he can act like we're
asking God to move and to, to
350
00:17:06,800 --> 00:17:08,880
have compassion and mercy on
them.
351
00:17:08,880 --> 00:17:11,720
And I, and, and I think it's, it
can be tough.
352
00:17:11,960 --> 00:17:14,599
I know it's tough.
It's one thing for us to talk
353
00:17:14,599 --> 00:17:17,400
about this in the abstract.
It's tough when you have a
354
00:17:17,400 --> 00:17:19,119
family member you've been
praying for, for years and
355
00:17:19,119 --> 00:17:21,839
years, you've presented the
gospel, nothing seems to work.
356
00:17:21,839 --> 00:17:25,839
And you're like, and I think
there can be somewhat
357
00:17:25,839 --> 00:17:28,800
legitimate.
This doesn't seem fair.
358
00:17:28,840 --> 00:17:30,840
And this is what Paul is exactly
addressing.
359
00:17:31,320 --> 00:17:35,240
And you know, the pushback isn't
just limited to your everyday
360
00:17:35,240 --> 00:17:38,640
layperson.
Pastor Joe will often reference
361
00:17:38,640 --> 00:17:41,560
Barclays commentary,
particularly for its historical
362
00:17:41,600 --> 00:17:46,000
insight, and his notes here is
flat out man.
363
00:17:46,000 --> 00:17:50,160
Paul uses a bad analogy.
One great New Testament
364
00:17:50,280 --> 00:17:53,360
commentator said that this is
one of the few passages which we
365
00:17:53,360 --> 00:17:58,320
wish Paul had not written.
And that's that's, I mean, you
366
00:17:58,360 --> 00:18:00,360
think about writing a
commentary, that's one way to go
367
00:18:00,360 --> 00:18:03,040
to say like, I don't, I don't
this is bad.
368
00:18:03,040 --> 00:18:04,320
This is bad.
I don't like this.
369
00:18:04,320 --> 00:18:06,840
Paul made a mistake.
I don't know how you I'd like to
370
00:18:06,840 --> 00:18:10,720
read what that person says on
the passages that say all
371
00:18:10,720 --> 00:18:12,880
scripture is God breathed and
profitable.
372
00:18:12,880 --> 00:18:15,000
Like how did they interpret
that?
373
00:18:15,000 --> 00:18:18,080
And then because I'm assuming
they can still consider the
374
00:18:18,080 --> 00:18:18,720
script.
Sure.
375
00:18:19,240 --> 00:18:22,040
And you would think, and it's
one of those things, I mean, and
376
00:18:22,040 --> 00:18:25,800
on one sense, I definitely don't
agree with this take, but I kind
377
00:18:25,800 --> 00:18:29,000
of like the honesty there
instead of saying something
378
00:18:29,000 --> 00:18:32,880
like, well, what Paul is really
saying and then like watering it
379
00:18:32,880 --> 00:18:35,440
out to where he says nothing.
That's the other thing you can
380
00:18:35,520 --> 00:18:36,040
try.
I don't know.
381
00:18:36,280 --> 00:18:37,280
That's a tough one to do with
this.
382
00:18:37,280 --> 00:18:41,240
Passage said when he said X is,
what he really meant was Y, you
383
00:18:41,240 --> 00:18:44,040
know, and it's like.
People do that kind of thing.
384
00:18:44,640 --> 00:18:48,360
So that really sets up, you
know, the criticism, the
385
00:18:48,360 --> 00:18:50,800
analogy, this Potter and clay
analogy.
386
00:18:50,920 --> 00:18:56,520
Then Paul is going to move on to
application and 2222 through 29.
387
00:18:56,520 --> 00:18:59,200
We'll look at Application part
122 and 23.
388
00:18:59,600 --> 00:19:02,160
Yeah, so this covers verses
2223.
389
00:19:02,160 --> 00:19:06,360
It says, what if God, although
willing to demonstrate His wrath
390
00:19:06,920 --> 00:19:11,560
to make His power known, endured
with much, much patience vessels
391
00:19:11,560 --> 00:19:15,560
of wrath, prepared for
destruction, and He did so to
392
00:19:15,560 --> 00:19:18,720
make known the riches of His
glory upon vessels of mercy,
393
00:19:18,960 --> 00:19:21,120
which He prepared beforehand for
glory.
394
00:19:21,560 --> 00:19:24,720
And so kind of going back to
these, you know, the different
395
00:19:24,720 --> 00:19:27,840
types of clay that He can make,
vessels of honor, vessels for
396
00:19:27,840 --> 00:19:31,520
common use, vessels of wrath,
vessels of mercy.
397
00:19:32,360 --> 00:19:36,560
God's the Potter and he is
making these vessels.
398
00:19:36,840 --> 00:19:39,560
And I think Joel did a good job.
Like they're definitely verses
399
00:19:39,560 --> 00:19:42,200
that talk about our
responsibility, our sinful
400
00:19:42,200 --> 00:19:46,200
nature, our desire to be our own
ruler.
401
00:19:46,280 --> 00:19:49,520
Those are in the Bible too.
And when we get to those, we
402
00:19:49,520 --> 00:19:52,240
preach those, we teach those.
But right now we're in Romans 9.
403
00:19:52,840 --> 00:19:55,840
This is big untrans sovereignty.
And so that's what we're doing.
404
00:19:55,840 --> 00:20:01,480
We're preaching and and teaching
those God makes those vessels so
405
00:20:01,480 --> 00:20:03,920
that he can demonstrate himself
to us.
406
00:20:03,920 --> 00:20:08,080
It's like, how do we know he's
merciful if we don't know he's
407
00:20:08,080 --> 00:20:10,480
also just?
How do we know he's just if he's
408
00:20:10,480 --> 00:20:12,720
not also merciful?
I think I think that that's
409
00:20:12,760 --> 00:20:15,320
good.
It's what's at stake is God's
410
00:20:15,320 --> 00:20:16,880
glory and God is all these
things.
411
00:20:16,880 --> 00:20:19,760
He hates sin, he's just, he's
perfect, but he's also loving,
412
00:20:19,760 --> 00:20:21,760
merciful, gracious and kind.
He's all of these things.
413
00:20:21,760 --> 00:20:25,760
And this is how we see he
displays, he's chosen to display
414
00:20:26,160 --> 00:20:28,360
his glory.
It's the same kind of thinking,
415
00:20:28,360 --> 00:20:30,800
I think when it comes to
something like the atonement.
416
00:20:31,040 --> 00:20:34,560
Everyone wants to emphasize, you
know, God, God loves you, but
417
00:20:34,560 --> 00:20:37,720
they don't want to emphasize
that there was a price to pay,
418
00:20:37,760 --> 00:20:39,200
right?
And it's like it's all these
419
00:20:39,200 --> 00:20:41,680
things.
It's not balanced and we might
420
00:20:41,680 --> 00:20:44,800
not understand it why it has to
be done this way to its fullest
421
00:20:44,800 --> 00:20:48,400
extent, but man, God is I like
this.
422
00:20:48,400 --> 00:20:50,840
You have this in the notes,
Michael, the just justifier.
423
00:20:50,840 --> 00:20:52,320
I almost.
Screamed that out.
424
00:20:52,680 --> 00:20:56,480
I was like, should I pull a Jack
here and and yell out the just
425
00:20:56,480 --> 00:20:58,800
justifier?
But that's what was ringing
426
00:20:58,800 --> 00:21:00,640
because that's what he's
demonstrating.
427
00:21:00,880 --> 00:21:05,160
I'm just I'm wrathful.
I take sin seriously.
428
00:21:05,640 --> 00:21:11,000
At the same time, I provided a
way for you, I, I can justify
429
00:21:11,000 --> 00:21:14,640
you because of that.
So it's those two natures of of
430
00:21:14,720 --> 00:21:16,280
himself that he's revealing to
us.
431
00:21:16,280 --> 00:21:19,000
And that, that's so good to keep
keep that in mind.
432
00:21:19,000 --> 00:21:22,360
And at the end of the day, you
know, you can read this text
433
00:21:22,400 --> 00:21:26,000
with God's glory in mind.
You can read this text with me
434
00:21:26,000 --> 00:21:27,960
in mind.
And, you know, getting that
435
00:21:27,960 --> 00:21:31,440
focus on him, I think helps
clarify everything else.
436
00:21:31,440 --> 00:21:33,960
And, and this is the part of the
show where Michael sings a song.
437
00:21:35,200 --> 00:21:37,360
Yeah, because he had in here.
It's ultimately about God and
438
00:21:37,360 --> 00:21:39,760
his glory, and it's about him,
not us.
439
00:21:39,760 --> 00:21:43,680
And have you seen this parody
song where this guy sings It's
440
00:21:43,680 --> 00:21:48,520
all about me for my glory and my
fame, You know, taking the
441
00:21:49,040 --> 00:21:52,280
taking the song that that was
originally written.
442
00:21:52,280 --> 00:21:54,600
It's all about you.
That feels great.
443
00:21:54,800 --> 00:21:55,920
But it's all about me.
Yeah.
444
00:21:55,960 --> 00:21:59,240
Yeah, nice.
And and also not only the part
445
00:21:59,240 --> 00:22:01,080
of the podcast where we're
seeing, but it's the part of the
446
00:22:01,080 --> 00:22:02,680
podcast where we go to the
Puritans.
447
00:22:03,000 --> 00:22:04,480
That's right.
Jonathan Edwards, pastor.
448
00:22:04,480 --> 00:22:06,720
Jill's getting the heavy hitters
out.
449
00:22:06,720 --> 00:22:09,600
You know you're getting into
some deep, deep theology.
450
00:22:10,200 --> 00:22:13,360
Jonathan Edwards has this
extended quote that Pedro quotes
451
00:22:13,600 --> 00:22:15,920
he writes.
It's a proper and excellent
452
00:22:15,920 --> 00:22:18,920
thing for infinite glory to
shine forth.
453
00:22:19,160 --> 00:22:21,840
For the same reason it's proper
that the shining 4th of God's
454
00:22:21,840 --> 00:22:26,040
glory should be complete, that
is, that all parts of his glory
455
00:22:26,040 --> 00:22:29,400
should shine forth, that every
beauty should be proportionally
456
00:22:29,800 --> 00:22:33,840
radiance, that the beholder may
have a proper notion of God.
457
00:22:34,440 --> 00:22:37,560
It's not proper that one glory
should be exceedingly manifested
458
00:22:37,560 --> 00:22:41,400
in another nut so evil is
necessary in order to the
459
00:22:41,400 --> 00:22:44,040
highest happiness of the
creature and the completeness of
460
00:22:44,040 --> 00:22:46,280
that communication of God for
which he made the world.
461
00:22:46,680 --> 00:22:50,720
Because the creatures happiness
consists in the knowledge of God
462
00:22:51,240 --> 00:22:53,120
and the sense of his love.
And if the knowledge of him be
463
00:22:53,120 --> 00:22:57,160
imperfect, the happiness of the
creature must be proportionately
464
00:22:57,480 --> 00:22:59,280
imperfect.
That if we don't see the full
465
00:22:59,280 --> 00:23:03,640
picture of God, we we're not.
We can't glory in God, be as
466
00:23:03,640 --> 00:23:06,160
happy in God, because we we
don't understand His full
467
00:23:06,360 --> 00:23:08,000
character.
That's right.
468
00:23:08,200 --> 00:23:11,960
That's, I think that's right on
all right, Application Part 2.
469
00:23:12,040 --> 00:23:15,640
So now we're taking verses 24
through 29 and really Paul's
470
00:23:15,640 --> 00:23:19,040
going to turn to the Old
Testament and show support of
471
00:23:19,040 --> 00:23:24,280
God being merciful in caring,
caring for and caring through
472
00:23:24,280 --> 00:23:28,960
this remnant of Jews.
So it starts out, even us whom
473
00:23:29,360 --> 00:23:34,120
he also called, not from among
Jews only, but also from among
474
00:23:34,120 --> 00:23:38,880
Gentiles, as he says in Hosea.
I will call those who are not my
475
00:23:38,880 --> 00:23:42,920
people, my people, and her who
is not beloved, beloved.
476
00:23:43,080 --> 00:23:46,320
And it shall be that in the
place where it was said to them,
477
00:23:46,640 --> 00:23:50,120
You are not my people, there
they shall be called sons of the
478
00:23:50,120 --> 00:23:52,680
living God.
Isaiah cries out concerning
479
00:23:52,680 --> 00:23:54,400
Israel.
Though the number of the sons of
480
00:23:54,400 --> 00:23:57,800
Israel be like the sand of the
sea, it is the remnant that will
481
00:23:57,800 --> 00:24:01,000
be saved, for the Lord will
execute His word on the earth
482
00:24:01,160 --> 00:24:04,920
thoroughly and quickly.
And just as Isaiah foretold,
483
00:24:05,000 --> 00:24:09,320
unless the Lord of the of
Sabbath had left us to a
484
00:24:09,320 --> 00:24:12,680
posterity, we would have become
like Sodom and would have
485
00:24:12,680 --> 00:24:16,120
resembled Gomorrah.
So even in the Old Testament,
486
00:24:16,600 --> 00:24:21,120
God is preserving His people and
others Speaking of Him, calling
487
00:24:21,120 --> 00:24:23,880
out a new people for himself out
of the Gentiles.
488
00:24:24,040 --> 00:24:27,040
Yeah, I think that's pretty
striking that we would have been
489
00:24:27,040 --> 00:24:30,040
like Sodom and Gomorrah without
without you, but got in his
490
00:24:30,040 --> 00:24:35,680
mercy, pulled out a remnant.
Moving on to the conclusion,
491
00:24:36,360 --> 00:24:40,440
verses 30 through 33, Paul
starts to starts to wrap, wrap
492
00:24:40,440 --> 00:24:43,040
up some of his arguments.
He says, what shall we say then?
493
00:24:43,520 --> 00:24:46,440
The Gentiles who didn't pursue
righteousness attained
494
00:24:46,440 --> 00:24:49,640
righteousness, even the
righteousness which is by faith.
495
00:24:50,160 --> 00:24:53,960
But Israel pursuing a law of
righteousness did not arrive at
496
00:24:53,960 --> 00:24:55,960
the law, at that law.
Why?
497
00:24:56,520 --> 00:24:59,720
Because they didn't pursue it by
faith, but as though it were by
498
00:24:59,720 --> 00:25:02,080
works.
They stumbled over the stumbling
499
00:25:02,080 --> 00:25:06,400
stone, just as it's written.
Behold, I lay in Zion a stone of
500
00:25:06,400 --> 00:25:10,160
stumbling and a rock of offense.
And he who believes in him will
501
00:25:10,160 --> 00:25:13,360
not be disappointed.
I'll make a note before I kick
502
00:25:13,360 --> 00:25:15,960
it to you, Michael.
But what I love about Paul as
503
00:25:15,960 --> 00:25:20,520
he's dealing with this, you
know, theodicy that this problem
504
00:25:20,520 --> 00:25:23,520
trying to vindicate God's
righteousness about Jewish
505
00:25:23,520 --> 00:25:27,200
people specifically, he's just
layering and Jewish after text.
506
00:25:27,240 --> 00:25:29,240
He's just Old Testaments in here
a lot.
507
00:25:29,240 --> 00:25:32,160
He's like trying to show no,
God's word hasn't failed and
508
00:25:32,160 --> 00:25:34,440
this is what the God of the Jews
has said.
509
00:25:34,840 --> 00:25:38,760
No, that's good.
Joel a couple times went to the
510
00:25:38,760 --> 00:25:42,360
message.
So here's that same passage that
511
00:25:42,360 --> 00:25:45,960
Zach just read out of.
Is it Peterson's message?
512
00:25:46,320 --> 00:25:48,480
Yeah, he says.
How can we sum this up?
513
00:25:48,480 --> 00:25:51,560
All those who didn't seem
interested in what God was doing
514
00:25:51,560 --> 00:25:54,400
actually embraced what God was
doing as he straightened out
515
00:25:54,400 --> 00:25:57,160
their lives.
And Israel, who seemed so
516
00:25:57,160 --> 00:25:59,600
interested in reading and
talking about what God was
517
00:25:59,600 --> 00:26:01,920
doing, missed it.
How could they miss it?
518
00:26:02,280 --> 00:26:05,560
Because instead of trusting God,
they took over.
519
00:26:05,840 --> 00:26:08,600
They are absorbed in what they
themselves were doing.
520
00:26:08,800 --> 00:26:11,560
They are absorbed in their God
projects.
521
00:26:11,560 --> 00:26:15,040
In scare quotes that they didn't
notice God right in front of
522
00:26:15,040 --> 00:26:17,360
them, like a huge rock in the
middle of the road.
523
00:26:17,600 --> 00:26:20,040
And so they stumbled into him
and went sprawling.
524
00:26:20,320 --> 00:26:23,720
Isaiah again gives us a metaphor
for pulling this together.
525
00:26:23,720 --> 00:26:27,680
Careful, I put a huge stone on
the road to Mount Zion, a stone
526
00:26:27,680 --> 00:26:30,680
you can't get around.
But the stone is me.
527
00:26:30,840 --> 00:26:34,720
If you're looking for me, you'll
find me on the way, not in the
528
00:26:34,720 --> 00:26:36,960
way.
Yeah, We find this kind of thing
529
00:26:36,960 --> 00:26:38,480
quoted a lot in the New
Testament.
530
00:26:38,480 --> 00:26:40,280
I feel like this stumbling
stone.
531
00:26:40,280 --> 00:26:43,560
Yeah, yeah.
That this imagery that you know,
532
00:26:43,560 --> 00:26:46,160
that the Jews missed it and and
Jesus was, was right there
533
00:26:46,160 --> 00:26:49,000
stumbling over him because, you
know, focused on, on works and
534
00:26:49,000 --> 00:26:52,480
not by faith in the Messiah who
was right there.
535
00:26:52,640 --> 00:26:55,520
Yeah, and Joel's like he could
either be a stumbling stone or
536
00:26:55,520 --> 00:26:57,120
stepping stone.
Yeah, that, that's.
537
00:26:57,160 --> 00:26:59,200
Good.
That's a good, good turn of a
538
00:26:59,200 --> 00:27:03,480
phrase there because if you
recognize God for whom Jesus,
539
00:27:03,480 --> 00:27:06,280
for whom he is, you recognize
yourself for who you are after
540
00:27:06,280 --> 00:27:09,120
you let the law really be the
tutor that it's meant to be to
541
00:27:09,120 --> 00:27:12,120
show you, you know what, you're
not going to keep the law.
542
00:27:12,400 --> 00:27:14,000
You're going to daily break the
law.
543
00:27:14,000 --> 00:27:18,920
You're going to, you know, daily
need some type of sacrifice.
544
00:27:18,920 --> 00:27:21,640
You're not ever, you know,
you're go back to the Sermon on
545
00:27:21,640 --> 00:27:23,400
the Mount.
Your righteousness is not going
546
00:27:23,400 --> 00:27:24,840
to exceed that of the scribes or
Pharisees.
547
00:27:24,840 --> 00:27:27,320
You're not going to be perfect
as your Father in heaven is.
548
00:27:28,000 --> 00:27:30,680
And so now you can go, OK, I
need help.
549
00:27:30,800 --> 00:27:32,840
And then that's where the stone
comes in, stepping up.
550
00:27:33,200 --> 00:27:36,280
Absolutely.
And so I think as we end Romans
551
00:27:36,280 --> 00:27:38,600
9, it's good just to consider
this whole flow of
552
00:27:38,600 --> 00:27:41,760
argumentation.
Has the word of God fail?
553
00:27:41,760 --> 00:27:44,440
You know, is God fair?
God, That can't be right.
554
00:27:44,720 --> 00:27:47,320
And then as we get into chapter
10, we look a little bit more at
555
00:27:47,320 --> 00:27:51,280
the means God uses because I
think the accusation, you know,
556
00:27:51,280 --> 00:27:55,120
levied hard against people who
are big on sovereignty of God is
557
00:27:55,520 --> 00:27:57,800
and I guess you don't witness.
And it's like, Oh well, chapter
558
00:27:57,800 --> 00:28:00,880
10's a lot about the means and
witnessing specifically.
559
00:28:00,880 --> 00:28:03,600
So it's like, you know, I think
those things are together in
560
00:28:03,600 --> 00:28:05,760
Paul's argument for for a
specific reason, right?
561
00:28:05,760 --> 00:28:08,440
Because these things, you know,
really complement each other.
562
00:28:08,600 --> 00:28:12,440
Yeah, if if you are as someone
who I've defined as a hyper
563
00:28:12,440 --> 00:28:15,120
Calvinist, then then you're not
taking the full counsel, the
564
00:28:15,120 --> 00:28:16,520
word, because we're still to
pray.
565
00:28:16,800 --> 00:28:19,600
We're still to witness because
we don't, you know, we don't
566
00:28:19,600 --> 00:28:23,600
know how God even uses those in
his, that's right, His sovereign
567
00:28:23,600 --> 00:28:25,560
plan.
So, you know, we're, we're
568
00:28:25,560 --> 00:28:30,040
supposed to be about that.
So application #1 he who
569
00:28:30,040 --> 00:28:35,080
believes in God will not be
disappointed.
570
00:28:35,760 --> 00:28:39,480
And he gave this illustration of
this kid who gives his mom this
571
00:28:39,480 --> 00:28:42,600
face mask for Christmas is like,
hey, mom, this face mask is
572
00:28:42,600 --> 00:28:44,480
supposed to make you pretty.
Put it on right now.
573
00:28:44,480 --> 00:28:45,800
And she puts it on, takes it
off.
574
00:28:45,800 --> 00:28:49,960
It's like didn't work.
Yeah, that, that that's so good.
575
00:28:49,960 --> 00:28:53,840
So by contrast, you believe in,
in Christ, your faith is in
576
00:28:53,840 --> 00:28:54,880
Christ.
You're a child of God.
577
00:28:54,880 --> 00:28:56,920
You you're not going to be
disappointed, even if that means
578
00:28:56,920 --> 00:29:00,360
you don't understand everything
totally that that's part of
579
00:29:00,360 --> 00:29:02,800
faith too, right?
That you will not be
580
00:29:02,800 --> 00:29:05,560
disappointed that that's a
that's a great first application
581
00:29:06,520 --> 00:29:09,640
because, you know, I think that
that is that emotional side.
582
00:29:09,640 --> 00:29:12,600
You just don't understand, you
know, man, why is people close
583
00:29:12,600 --> 00:29:13,320
to me?
Why?
584
00:29:13,320 --> 00:29:14,960
Why is this not working out how
I would hope?
585
00:29:15,520 --> 00:29:18,160
Yeah, and if you find yourself
in that place of disappointment,
586
00:29:18,200 --> 00:29:20,680
you know, I would just say go
back to Scripture like Ephesians
587
00:29:20,680 --> 00:29:24,400
one, all that we have in Christ,
Romans 8, which we just read
588
00:29:24,400 --> 00:29:26,080
about, you know, all creations
groaning.
589
00:29:26,240 --> 00:29:28,600
We don't ever, we don't
understand how we're supposed to
590
00:29:28,600 --> 00:29:30,800
pray necessarily.
Spirit is groaning on our
591
00:29:30,800 --> 00:29:33,040
behalf.
First Corinthians 15, we're
592
00:29:33,040 --> 00:29:34,440
going to get a new body.
We're going to get a
593
00:29:34,440 --> 00:29:36,160
resurrection body just like
Jesus.
594
00:29:36,560 --> 00:29:38,040
Revelation 20.
There's going to be a New
595
00:29:38,040 --> 00:29:39,640
Jerusalem.
We're going to be with him.
596
00:29:39,960 --> 00:29:42,280
You know, there's not going to
be even a need for a son because
597
00:29:42,280 --> 00:29:44,200
he's going to be our light, all
of our tears at light.
598
00:29:44,440 --> 00:29:49,240
So we have all of these promises
for this future hope and what
599
00:29:49,240 --> 00:29:53,040
God's done for us that we should
be able to go OK in the here and
600
00:29:53,040 --> 00:29:54,640
now.
I don't exactly understand what
601
00:29:54,640 --> 00:29:56,760
you're doing, God, but I'm, I'm
going to trust you.
602
00:29:56,760 --> 00:29:58,040
I'm not going to be disappointed
in you.
603
00:29:58,680 --> 00:30:02,960
So, so good application 2, you
know, thinking about divine
604
00:30:02,960 --> 00:30:05,040
sovereignty and human
responsibility.
605
00:30:05,040 --> 00:30:07,480
I think, you know, pastor girl
said it well, I'm going to
606
00:30:07,480 --> 00:30:09,040
preach what the text says.
There's another text that's
607
00:30:09,040 --> 00:30:10,520
going to talk about human
responsibility.
608
00:30:10,520 --> 00:30:15,920
I will preach that hard as well.
And I think people unfairly just
609
00:30:16,360 --> 00:30:18,600
put pigeonhole people into one,
one or the other.
610
00:30:18,600 --> 00:30:20,640
And it's like, why can't we have
both, right?
611
00:30:20,840 --> 00:30:23,440
You know, why can't we just
agree that Scripture speaks to
612
00:30:23,440 --> 00:30:25,840
both?
And maybe we can't totally in
613
00:30:25,840 --> 00:30:27,880
our minds reconcile everything
perfectly.
614
00:30:27,880 --> 00:30:32,560
This great quote by Ward Wersby
says no one will deny that there
615
00:30:32,560 --> 00:30:34,520
are many mysteries that
connected with divine
616
00:30:34,520 --> 00:30:37,160
sovereignty and human
responsibility.
617
00:30:37,440 --> 00:30:40,120
Nowhere does God ask us to
choose between these two truths
618
00:30:40,240 --> 00:30:43,120
because they both come from God
and are part of God's plan.
619
00:30:43,560 --> 00:30:45,480
They do not compete, they
cooperate.
620
00:30:46,080 --> 00:30:49,000
The fact that we cannot fully
understand how they work
621
00:30:49,000 --> 00:30:51,880
together doesn't deny the fact
that they do.
622
00:30:52,040 --> 00:30:54,440
When a man asked Charles
Spurgeon how he reconciled
623
00:30:54,440 --> 00:30:57,520
divine sovereignty and human
responsibility, Spurgeon
624
00:30:57,520 --> 00:31:00,480
replied, I never try to
reconcile friends.
625
00:31:00,800 --> 00:31:06,000
And so I, I, I think sometimes
you can be so focused on one of
626
00:31:06,000 --> 00:31:07,120
those, you can kind of minimize
it.
627
00:31:07,200 --> 00:31:09,400
It's a good, it's a good give
and take, a good balance.
628
00:31:09,400 --> 00:31:12,560
I think at the end of the day,
you just want to be anchored to
629
00:31:12,720 --> 00:31:15,120
some text and that and that
helps.
630
00:31:15,120 --> 00:31:18,240
But no one's saying your actions
don't matter.
631
00:31:18,640 --> 00:31:19,240
Right.
Yeah.
632
00:31:19,240 --> 00:31:22,360
And I think you have to be
faithful to the text.
633
00:31:22,360 --> 00:31:24,920
And then you got to find out,
you know, in your systematic
634
00:31:24,920 --> 00:31:28,800
theology, which everyone has,
whether they realize it or not,
635
00:31:29,120 --> 00:31:33,000
you have to figure out a way
that you can kind of be true to
636
00:31:33,000 --> 00:31:36,040
all these different texts, like
what way of understanding
637
00:31:36,040 --> 00:31:39,880
salvation or what way of
understanding who God is really
638
00:31:39,960 --> 00:31:43,040
can be faithful to all these
different texts and how we
639
00:31:43,040 --> 00:31:46,480
understand them.
And so, but yeah, there's,
640
00:31:46,560 --> 00:31:48,960
there's, there's texts out there
that talk about God's
641
00:31:48,960 --> 00:31:52,400
sovereignty, text that talks
about our responsibility.
642
00:31:52,400 --> 00:31:55,600
And you really should not
shouldn't be a A cause of
643
00:31:55,600 --> 00:31:59,200
argument because it's clearly
what scripture says.
644
00:31:59,680 --> 00:32:01,520
Right, right there.
It's in the Bible.
645
00:32:01,520 --> 00:32:03,640
That's why we believe in the
sovereignty of God.
646
00:32:04,400 --> 00:32:06,920
People can get bogged down.
It's not these are important
647
00:32:06,920 --> 00:32:10,440
truths, but you can really get
bogged down and not and be
648
00:32:10,440 --> 00:32:14,080
talking past each other.
And then kind of that concluding
649
00:32:14,400 --> 00:32:17,600
passage that Paul mentioned
that, you know, Christ is a
650
00:32:17,600 --> 00:32:19,800
stumbling stone, but you're not
not for us.
651
00:32:19,800 --> 00:32:24,800
If you have faith, faith in
Christ, you can rest, rest in
652
00:32:24,800 --> 00:32:27,600
this truth and not and not be
like the Jews that were, you
653
00:32:27,600 --> 00:32:29,720
know, just trying to work it out
on their own.
654
00:32:31,040 --> 00:32:33,880
Then we looked at Communion
because we took communion today
655
00:32:34,000 --> 00:32:39,520
and, you know, his blood
inaugurated the new Covenant.
656
00:32:40,000 --> 00:32:42,600
And I don't you're, you're not a
big movie guy, so I'm gonna make
657
00:32:42,600 --> 00:32:44,960
a reference.
You may or may not see How to
658
00:32:44,960 --> 00:32:46,000
Train a Dragon.
Have you seen?
659
00:32:46,160 --> 00:32:47,240
That I have not.
I've heard it's good.
660
00:32:48,120 --> 00:32:51,520
So like in that, in that movie,
in the second movie in all the
661
00:32:51,520 --> 00:32:54,240
series, like there's the main
character Hiccup, he'll always
662
00:32:54,240 --> 00:32:57,480
say stuff like they'll find
something out that's new or, and
663
00:32:57,480 --> 00:33:00,160
he'll say this changes
everything.
664
00:33:00,600 --> 00:33:03,760
I was like, that's we need to
take that clip from him saying
665
00:33:03,760 --> 00:33:06,960
that like married up with like
something like, you know, the
666
00:33:06,960 --> 00:33:08,920
blood of the covenant or Christ
resurrection.
667
00:33:08,920 --> 00:33:12,040
Like this changes everything.
And it should be a cause for us
668
00:33:12,040 --> 00:33:14,680
to rejoice in in who Christ is
and when He's done for us.
669
00:33:15,040 --> 00:33:17,640
Romans 9.
Romans 9 in the books In the
670
00:33:17,640 --> 00:33:20,080
books.
Moving on to to Romans 10.
671
00:33:20,960 --> 00:33:22,520
Still got a lot of lot of
romance to go.
672
00:33:22,520 --> 00:33:25,000
A lot of romance to go.
I can't wait till, you know, we
673
00:33:25,000 --> 00:33:27,360
get to that last chapter.
We'll get a lot of names in
674
00:33:27,360 --> 00:33:29,120
there.
That's right.
675
00:33:29,120 --> 00:33:30,760
You're getting Michael's whole
family in there.
676
00:33:30,760 --> 00:33:33,280
That's great.
Yeah, Phoebe and Julia are are
677
00:33:33,360 --> 00:33:34,360
in there I believe.
Wow.
678
00:33:34,800 --> 00:33:38,000
Pretty, pretty cool.
Any anything else you got
679
00:33:38,000 --> 00:33:40,320
Michael?
No, I, I'm good.
680
00:33:41,080 --> 00:33:45,800
Awesome, That's our take.
Thanks for listening to Take 2.
681
00:33:46,520 --> 00:33:49,120
Find us wherever you find
podcasts and on YouTube for
682
00:33:49,120 --> 00:33:50,840
those who want to watch our
video cast.