Miracles: Awe, Authority, and the God Who Acts

Episode 2.38
What counts as a real miracle—and why does it matter?
In this episode of Take 2 Theology, Zach and Michael define what a biblical miracle is (and isn’t), explore how miracles appear across Scripture, and reflect on their purpose in God’s redemptive plan. Drawing from theologians like Wayne Grudem and John Frame, the episode highlights how miracles aren’t just flashy interruptions but covenant-signs of God’s power and faithfulness.
Covered in this episode:
– Defining miracles: Grudem vs. Frame
– Why miracles are rare—and why that’s the point
– Old and New Testament miracle clusters
– Why some eras (like Judges or today) see fewer miracles
– The difference between miracles and providence
– Whether miracles still happen today
– Why the greatest miracle may be the new birth
Not all wonders are miracles—but every true miracle points to the God who rules nature, time, and salvation itself.
Find our videocast here: https://youtu.be/hrfwPeebGVY
Merch here: https://take-2-podcast.printify.me/
Music from #Uppbeat (free for Creators!):
https://uppbeat.io/t/reakt-music/deep-stone
License code: 2QZOZ2YHZ5UTE7C8
Find more Take 2 Theology content at http://www.take2theology.com
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Babyface is here.
I I I'm trying to decide whether
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I launch into this 'cause I was
in a Dixieland band.
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And whoa.
Oh.
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Oh, Dixie, Wait a minute.
Dixieland Band.
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Is that what I said?
Yeah, yeah.
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Yeah, you nailed it.
Yeah, I thought I said Dixie
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band land.
That'd be pretty.
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Funny.
Maybe you did.
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Maybe I did.
Yeah, and there's a song we
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played.
Babyface, Babyface.
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There you go.
I love my babyface.
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Baby, we just got, we just got
cancelled 'cause you said
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Dixieland, YouTube's censoring
us.
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We're shadow bands.
Oh, I didn't.
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Even think about that.
Yeah.
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Yeah.
Well.
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No, I'm I'm just kidding, but.
I'll just say most of the
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Dixieland bands are not
Caucasian.
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There there.
You go yeah, yeah, yeah.
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So in New Orleans and stuff, so
you can go down there and they
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walk around clarinet and
sousaphone and, you know, string
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bass and stuff.
It's it's all it's all it's
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really good.
Saxophones, trumpets, saxophone,
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that that's what you want to
talk about Dixieland music like
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hard hearted Hannah babyface.
I listen.
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To Maple Leaf Rag, I'm.
I'm getting used to the clean
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shaven look.
You liking it?
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I'm not really, I was kind of
actually bummed.
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I was like just trying to trim,
trim up the like on the sides
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and I over cut and then I was
trying to even it out and then I
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over cut and then and my goat
just kept getting narrower and
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narrower and it was looking
pretty rough.
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Yeah, and you were doing this on
your own or Liam?
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Was on on my own.
That was probably my mistake.
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But then I was like, Liam, does
it look bad?
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She's like, not that bad.
But then the more I looked at
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it, I was like, I'm just gonna
shave it off.
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The thing that hurts my heart
the most is I've had I've had
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multiple people be like, man,
looks better that you shave it
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off.
I'm.
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Like, oh.
That's like so sad to.
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Me.
You know, I think maybe, you
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know, if I were to say, yeah,
yeah, yeah, probably somewhere
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in the middle.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
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Not, not the excessive.
Just let it go.
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Yeah, when Duck Dynasty was all
a rage, man, I was.
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And I still feel like at some
point in time I should just let
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this thing go.
November.
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Yeah, well.
For the Christmas play.
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Yeah, but it doesn't really get
that long if you already have
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this.
Yeah, just a month of growth
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like this is probably, you know,
I shave it down to like a 1 1/2.
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This is probably a week and a
half old.
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So it's not going to get like,
it's not going to get Duck
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Dynasty proportions in a month.
Hey, don't, don't cut yourself
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short, you know, just just go
with it.
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I am going.
To So what I hear you saying is
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I should shave clean.
Yes, at the start of November.
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Yes, I'm going to keep myself
queen shaving till November and
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then I don't know, I'm not going
to shave for a long time, so
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then that.
Will be like babyface.
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I probably have, like, you know,
some people who've I've had this
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beard since, Yeah.
A long time 20. 12/20/11 I don't
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know, you know, some people have
like weird like wrinkles and
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stuff that like they don't.
Even know what you'll look like.
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Yeah, that's great.
It'll be like a whole like shade
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lighter has not like seen the
sun, you know?
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Like it'll be red because it's
like the first part of sun will
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make it like the lobster or
something.
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Yeah, yeah, there you go.
So, you know, I'm getting used
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to it.
I I kind of like it, but I did
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like, I just like the commitment
of growing it out, you know what
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I mean?
It's like you really put some
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effort into it.
Yeah, and I don't think that you
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were gonna keep it till a
wedding.
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That's in a couple days, right?
Yeah, yeah, that's what I was.
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That was the plan at least that
long.
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And it just felt like I
accomplished something and I
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don't.
I just like think it looked
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better, but it was like, man, I
just like I loved, I loved it,
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man.
It's.
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Great.
What did Leanne think?
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She she was actually encouraging
me to keep it.
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Yeah, that's, you know that is,
you know, just listen to your
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wife on I.
Know, yeah, that's why should I
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keep it going, you know?
So maybe she just knows it keeps
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me like unattractive to the rest
of the world, you know what I
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mean?
Yeah, honey, keep it, keep it.
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You know, and also you shouldn't
like don't change your clothes
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it's been 3 days whatever.
It looks great.
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Yeah, yeah.
So I don't know We'll we'll see
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we'll we'll have to but when,
when it gets closer to we'll
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have to really think about it.
What's going to be tricky is we
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record too much in advance
right.
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But if we talk about like no
shave November, we'll be like in
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December, like, hey, we're not
going to shave, you know, so.
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Yeah, it'll be January when it
airs.
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Yeah, that's gonna be good.
I don't know, but yeah, what
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what goes right along with clean
shaven Yeah is talking about
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people groups in the Bible.
Oh.
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That's good.
That's good.
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It's different, you know.
Some some people groups Let's
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roll the beard.
Well, yeah, some people don't
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that that's.
Right, you know, so, you know,
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all over the place and we can go
back, you know, where, where
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did, where did all the people
come from?
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You know, we can, we can kind of
trace some of that.
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This is the cotton eye, Joe.
You know where they come from,
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where they go, where.
They there we go.
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Yeah, that's exactly right.
So not a Abraham episode, it's
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slightly private.
If Abraham says 12, we're not
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going that far backwards from a
numerical.
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Standpoint.
Yeah, we're, we're what we'll
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be, we'll be in like 10 and
11:10 and 11:00.
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So we're right before 12.
So anyway, table of nations and
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people groups, let's take it to
the next level from the hearts
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of the Low Country in South
Carolina.
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It's the Take Two podcast where
we take theology to the next
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level.
You, you hear this phrase a lot,
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like, you know, and all goes
back to Adam.
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Yeah.
And that is true.
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But it really goes back to Noah.
But Noah, yeah, exactly where,
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you know, I feel like Noah
doesn't get any love.
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Like we're all related to Adam,
right?
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And we are.
But it's like people don't don't
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bring up Noah as much, you know?
Yeah.
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And yeah, I guess it is all Noah
or Noah's wife.
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Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Well, actually, OK.
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Yeah, yeah, yeah.
You do have to be this in a
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Noah, but you do get some like
so the son's wives, those are
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three different families.
Potentially, Yeah, yeah, yeah,
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yeah.
That's.
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True.
That's true, you know.
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That's a good point.
Yeah, but you have some gene,
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some genes coming in from those
other families.
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But yeah, and and unless you
have some Nephilim.
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Unless and what?
Yeah.
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And then?
Graph I am Jeans.
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You gotta be careful we can't
see it too many times where Clay
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will show up.
We don't want Clay might be like
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enjoying dinner with his family.
We don't want to like, pull him
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over.
Here.
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Unnecessarily, but what I like
about this episode, it's one of
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those maybe like big picture,
connect the dots like we're it's
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not about Abraham really at all,
but it kind of, you know, big
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picture and we'll talk about,
you know, where did Abraham
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descend from kind of look at
some of that, maybe understand
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Bible history, even understand
some of the conflicts we see in
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the Bible.
Some of these like are baked
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into some of these familial
lines.
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And even more global than that.
You see God's plan for
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redemption starting, right.
I mean, we get that glimpse up
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in Genesis 12, but but really
get some of the disorder that
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gets like revisited in the New
Testament, which is pretty,
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pretty cool.
You want to read Acts 17 verses
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26 and 27 because it kind of
talks about, you know, oh,
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mankind.
And He made from one man every
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nation of mankind, to live on
all the face of the earth,
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having determined allotted
periods and the boundaries of
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their dwelling place, that they
should see God, and perhaps feel
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their way toward Him and find
Him.
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Nice think you're talking about
Adam.
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Probably Adam.
Yeah, I was like, I was like, I
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feel like we had to say that
because we just made this big
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thing about Noah.
But you know, I don't want to.
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I don't want to like read the
wrong I.
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Mean it got it all got started
off with Adam.
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And that's right.
Yeah, that's right.
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We're not saying Adam, you know,
wasn't involved, but.
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And there were people between
Adam and Noah.
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That's true that this would
apply to that.
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That would apply to exactly
right?
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Well, let's let's set the stage.
Genesis 6 is the flood.
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We get past the flood.
Noah's there, three children,
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wives, this kind of thing.
We get.
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We get.
Explicitly told we can eat meat
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now Big.
Deal.
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That's a big deal, yeah,
Seasons, but I think.
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They're eating meat before then.
I do.
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But but, but now it's like go
for it, eat meat.
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Just not with the blood stay.
Stay away for that from that
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from that blood.
So if we were looking Genesis 12
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is Abraham.
Genesis 10 is referred to as a
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table of nations got a lot of
genealogies.
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Genesis 11 is the Tower of Babel
and I think this can be
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confusing to people because it's
it's not in chronological order.
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You read it and and you're like,
why are we learning about people
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all being together after we read
about everyone's descendants
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before and that can be
confusing.
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And I think it's another good
example.
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So is.
It like, hey, here are the
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00:08:29,000 --> 00:08:33,799
nations, here's how we got them.
Exactly, exactly the reason.
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It's like, you know, in our
Western mind, that's not how we
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would probably map things out.
That's a good reminder of the
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Bible.
A lot of times it's thematically
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or theologically or there
there's there's usually a reason
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if it's not like in every door
or you're like, what's the
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00:08:45,000 --> 00:08:46,480
reason?
I think, I think you're exactly
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00:08:46,480 --> 00:08:50,240
right that it's exactly as
simple as that.
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That kind of talks about God's
command to fill the earth out.
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He's making, you know,
everyone's going.
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00:08:55,280 --> 00:08:58,080
And then it talks about, you
know, humanity's rebellion, that
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they really wanted to be in one
place and God's gonna, you know,
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00:09:01,160 --> 00:09:06,360
send them all over the world.
So Michael's getting his Bible
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out.
You're ready to read.
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00:09:07,200 --> 00:09:09,920
I know you.
You just hate reading these ESV
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00:09:10,040 --> 00:09:11,600
passages.
You got to get it.
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I.
Wanted to be able to kind of
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00:09:13,440 --> 00:09:16,800
glance at the whole thing, but
yeah I'm happy to read from NASB
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as well.
Please do if you want to read
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Genesis 9 verse one going back
to Noah and.
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God bless Noah and his sons and
said to them, be fruitful and
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multiply and fill the earth and
if we're.
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00:09:29,320 --> 00:09:32,760
Going to Fast forward to Genesis
1032, you want to read that one
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00:09:32,760 --> 00:09:36,360
as well?
These are the families of the
216
00:09:36,360 --> 00:09:39,880
sons of Noah, according to their
genealogies by their nations,
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and out of these the nations
were separated on the earth
218
00:09:43,000 --> 00:09:44,720
after the flood.
So you, you kind.
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00:09:44,720 --> 00:09:47,000
Of see these kind of go
together, be fruitful, multiply,
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00:09:47,000 --> 00:09:49,480
fill the earth.
But then Genesis 11, we kind of
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00:09:49,480 --> 00:09:52,360
get this, this negative story of
how God's kind of making this
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00:09:52,360 --> 00:09:55,960
happen a little bit more.
They said, Come, let us bind for
223
00:09:55,960 --> 00:09:59,840
ourselves, build for ourselves a
city and a tower whose top will
224
00:09:59,840 --> 00:10:04,040
reach into the heaven, and let
us make for ourselves a name,
225
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otherwise we will be scattered
abroad over the face of the
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whole earth.
Come, let us go down.
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00:10:10,280 --> 00:10:13,000
And they're confused their
language, so that they will not
228
00:10:13,000 --> 00:10:16,200
understand one another's speech.
So the Lord scattered them
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abroad from there over the face
of the whole earth, and they
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stopped building the city.
Therefore its name was called
231
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Babel or Babel, because they're
the Lord confused the language
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of the whole earth.
And from there the Lord
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scattered them abroad over the
face of the whole earth.
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00:10:31,680 --> 00:10:33,920
All right, probably very
familiar, most of our listeners
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00:10:33,920 --> 00:10:37,600
with with this accounts.
So so that's kind of what
236
00:10:37,600 --> 00:10:40,600
happens.
And we get these different lines
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00:10:40,720 --> 00:10:43,040
from Noah, we get Ham.
I love I love the name too.
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00:10:43,040 --> 00:10:44,600
I love, you know, with translate
stuff.
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00:10:44,600 --> 00:10:48,800
We've got Ham, we've got Shim
and then we got Japheth and you
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00:10:48,800 --> 00:10:52,520
kind of trace where these people
settled in and people groups and
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00:10:52,520 --> 00:10:54,640
that kind of thing.
At least, you know, broad
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00:10:54,640 --> 00:10:56,480
strokes.
I think it's interesting to kind
243
00:10:56,480 --> 00:11:00,280
of trace some of that down.
So if we're looking at Ham's
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00:11:00,280 --> 00:11:04,120
line, you know, a lot of this is
you maybe could label it
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00:11:04,120 --> 00:11:05,920
southern and western, I don't
know, but you'll look at things
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00:11:05,920 --> 00:11:09,160
like Cush, which would be like
Ethiopia, that kind of thing.
247
00:11:09,480 --> 00:11:14,280
Egypt's Canaan put that would be
Libya or North Africa.
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00:11:14,280 --> 00:11:15,920
And then when you think of
Canaan, you think of all the
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00:11:16,200 --> 00:11:19,680
Hittites, Amorites, Jabucites,
Siden, the Canaanites.
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00:11:19,920 --> 00:11:23,360
The this is generally where hams
line descend.
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00:11:23,360 --> 00:11:28,160
So we're talking.
Maybe like Iraq over down to the
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00:11:28,160 --> 00:11:32,000
eastern side, eastern and
northern side of Africa, yeah.
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00:11:32,000 --> 00:11:34,440
I, I would say to so and, and
when you read the Bible about
254
00:11:34,440 --> 00:11:39,760
Kush a lot, I, I think they,
that's almost really associated
255
00:11:39,760 --> 00:11:41,960
with people with very, very dark
skin.
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00:11:42,720 --> 00:11:46,920
I think there's like a verse in
Jeremiah that's like, can a
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00:11:46,920 --> 00:11:49,840
leopard change his spots or a
Kushite the color of his skin?
258
00:11:49,840 --> 00:11:53,440
And it's kind of like really a
play on on like just how dark
259
00:11:53,440 --> 00:11:54,920
skin is.
So I I think that's exactly
260
00:11:54,920 --> 00:11:55,440
right.
Yeah.
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00:11:56,280 --> 00:11:57,600
And so we read about some of
these people.
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00:11:57,600 --> 00:11:59,360
So we.
Think Ham was really dark
263
00:11:59,360 --> 00:12:01,680
skinned or we think maybe his
wife was really dark skinned.
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00:12:01,800 --> 00:12:06,240
Maybe that see, I would love to
like see and I, I, I don't know,
265
00:12:06,520 --> 00:12:09,880
those are good things to think
about where maybe maybe so, you
266
00:12:09,880 --> 00:12:12,720
know, at least that genetic
makeup was in there somehow.
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00:12:12,800 --> 00:12:13,760
So.
Is it?
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00:12:14,000 --> 00:12:18,920
Is it reasonable to say if you
have today darker skin like, you
269
00:12:18,920 --> 00:12:23,200
know, darker melanin, you're on
that side you you probably have
270
00:12:23,640 --> 00:12:27,080
some in your background?
Some $1,000,000 idea instead of
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00:12:27,080 --> 00:12:30,840
23andMe ham.
Yeah, 3 and me ham sham and
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00:12:30,840 --> 00:12:34,160
JPEG.
You're 23% ham.
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00:12:35,680 --> 00:12:36,400
There's something.
There.
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00:12:36,440 --> 00:12:40,280
You know this is.
Like Ken Ham's probably on that.
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00:12:40,280 --> 00:12:43,520
He's probably like he's probably
got that down, but we see a lot
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00:12:43,520 --> 00:12:46,360
of these people groups in the
Bible through, you know, Egypt
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00:12:46,400 --> 00:12:49,440
enslaving Israel, Philistines
opposing Israel, Canaanites
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00:12:49,440 --> 00:12:54,800
driving, being driven out by
Joshua and then interesting you
279
00:12:54,920 --> 00:12:58,280
we hear this curse of ham a lot,
but a.
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00:12:58,320 --> 00:13:01,680
Proper reading, yes.
Makes it not Ham himself.
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00:13:01,720 --> 00:13:06,640
It's like 1 of Ham's sons, yeah.
Exactly right and a lot of
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00:13:06,640 --> 00:13:11,480
people would use like this this
is like hey This is why slavery
283
00:13:11,480 --> 00:13:12,800
is good.
I'm going to use the Bible to
284
00:13:12,800 --> 00:13:16,160
justify this is the curse.
We're just like fulfilling God.
285
00:13:16,160 --> 00:13:17,560
So you're.
Telling me people can
286
00:13:17,560 --> 00:13:22,840
misinterpret the Bible.
Yeah, and in a crazy bad way.
287
00:13:22,840 --> 00:13:27,040
It's like you can stand by and
you know, I'm trying to think
288
00:13:28,040 --> 00:13:31,320
like, I think I don't think it
went super far, but like there's
289
00:13:31,320 --> 00:13:35,000
notes in like the Schofield
Study Bible that talk about this
290
00:13:35,000 --> 00:13:37,720
in a pejorative way, which
you're like, that wasn't that
291
00:13:37,720 --> 00:13:39,520
long ago.
Like people in Mitras growing up
292
00:13:39,520 --> 00:13:41,120
with like Schofield Study
Bible's the best.
293
00:13:41,720 --> 00:13:44,160
The ones they had I think had
this edited out by then, but it
294
00:13:44,160 --> 00:13:47,680
was like in, it was in like
Schofield's original study
295
00:13:47,680 --> 00:13:48,400
Bible.
He was like that.
296
00:13:48,400 --> 00:13:51,160
That was kind of like one of the
first premier mainstream study
297
00:13:51,160 --> 00:13:53,880
Bibles.
Yeah, I think that's good to
298
00:13:54,120 --> 00:13:56,600
address that and get on the
table that that that is a
299
00:13:56,600 --> 00:14:01,160
misinterpretation of this.
That was a curse to his son and
300
00:14:01,200 --> 00:14:04,160
it was like local to him.
And it doesn't say that's going
301
00:14:04,160 --> 00:14:06,640
to go to like all of his
descendants everywhere it.
302
00:14:06,640 --> 00:14:10,280
Says he said cursed be Canaan, a
servant of servant shall be to
303
00:14:10,280 --> 00:14:11,640
his brothers.
He also said blessed be the
304
00:14:11,720 --> 00:14:13,640
where they got a shem and let
Canaan be his servant.
305
00:14:14,040 --> 00:14:17,360
May God enlarge Japheth and let
him dwell in the tents of Shem
306
00:14:17,640 --> 00:14:22,840
and let Canaan be his servant.
So, so there you go.
307
00:14:22,840 --> 00:14:25,360
And I think, you know, you get
you get some color on this too,
308
00:14:25,360 --> 00:14:30,800
even with SO.
So Canaan probably, you know, if
309
00:14:30,800 --> 00:14:35,040
we're just talking about people
groups and skin tone, he would
310
00:14:35,040 --> 00:14:39,160
have the lighter skin of that
because he went up into the
311
00:14:39,960 --> 00:14:42,360
Israel and he was the
Canaanized, the Hittites, which
312
00:14:42,360 --> 00:14:44,640
are not the dark, dark skin of
Africa.
313
00:14:44,640 --> 00:14:46,600
So it doesn't even fit the
that's so.
314
00:14:46,600 --> 00:14:49,680
Crazy that it gets like lumped
as the curse of Ham and then,
315
00:14:49,680 --> 00:14:52,400
yeah, it's like all these things
kind of get changed.
316
00:14:52,400 --> 00:14:56,520
So anyway that that is Ham's
line, next Shim's line, which is
317
00:14:56,520 --> 00:15:00,520
where we get maybe some Eastern
nations and then we get Semitic
318
00:15:00,800 --> 00:15:04,120
people groups.
Elam, that's Persia, Asher,
319
00:15:04,120 --> 00:15:08,440
Assyria, Arafat said.
The line maybe that led up to
320
00:15:08,440 --> 00:15:13,000
Abraham, Arum, Syrians, that
kind of thing.
321
00:15:14,160 --> 00:15:18,120
And we see, you know, Messianic,
Messianic promise flowing
322
00:15:18,120 --> 00:15:21,600
through this line of Shim.
So Shim's line looking for the
323
00:15:21,600 --> 00:15:23,240
sins, you see them a lot.
A Latin stripper, right?
324
00:15:23,440 --> 00:15:26,240
Yeah, So this would be like if
you're thinking visually like
325
00:15:26,240 --> 00:15:29,440
the Persians, maybe skin, dark,
dark skin or mean dark, dark
326
00:15:29,440 --> 00:15:32,480
hair, but maybe lighter olive
skin.
327
00:15:32,480 --> 00:15:33,720
Yeah, that's.
Probably right?
328
00:15:34,680 --> 00:15:38,480
Like you, you think of like
someone from Iran or maybe
329
00:15:38,800 --> 00:15:41,400
Kazakhstan or you know those,
right.
330
00:15:41,680 --> 00:15:44,880
But you know, you have like you
start moving over and then you
331
00:15:44,880 --> 00:15:47,440
get into India, then you get
some really, really dark
332
00:15:47,440 --> 00:15:51,120
pigmented folks.
And I wonder how those bridge
333
00:15:51,160 --> 00:15:55,440
the gap because, you know, most
of Asia they are.
334
00:15:55,480 --> 00:15:59,120
They're lighter in tone, maybe
darker, maybe darker than a
335
00:15:59,120 --> 00:16:00,520
European.
Yeah.
336
00:16:00,520 --> 00:16:02,280
Yeah.
You know, it's just fascinating
337
00:16:02,280 --> 00:16:03,760
how that all came about.
And it is.
338
00:16:03,760 --> 00:16:06,280
Fascinating.
Like maybe people that just
339
00:16:06,640 --> 00:16:12,080
yeah, had darker melanin just
naturally did better a little
340
00:16:12,080 --> 00:16:14,520
farther S with the heat.
And I mean, it's I mean, you
341
00:16:14,520 --> 00:16:16,120
know what I mean?
It's like those people maybe
342
00:16:16,120 --> 00:16:17,800
that stayed there and other
people filtered away.
343
00:16:17,800 --> 00:16:19,800
I don't, I don't know.
It's it that is.
344
00:16:19,800 --> 00:16:23,560
And then there's been so many,
you know, war, all these things
345
00:16:23,560 --> 00:16:26,400
that move people groups and
these things, it's hard to hard
346
00:16:26,400 --> 00:16:28,000
to.
So then we've got Japheth, you
347
00:16:28,000 --> 00:16:30,720
know, maybe you're thinking
northern and coastal peoples.
348
00:16:30,720 --> 00:16:35,240
We got like the Gomer people,
Magog, Medes.
349
00:16:36,280 --> 00:16:41,680
Greeks really come from the
Javan line, Tuba, Meshech,
350
00:16:41,720 --> 00:16:44,520
Terasberry, common people groups
we've all heard of millions of
351
00:16:44,520 --> 00:16:47,520
times.
So we've read about the Greeks,
352
00:16:47,520 --> 00:16:50,880
you know, you go to the book of
Daniel Medes of Persian and
353
00:16:50,880 --> 00:16:54,880
Esther and Daniel as well.
Magog Ezekiel, you know, that's
354
00:16:54,880 --> 00:16:58,560
like, you know, I love, you know
this guy Doug Wilson, I have
355
00:16:58,560 --> 00:17:01,920
heard of him from Moscow, ID.
His church is really big.
356
00:17:01,920 --> 00:17:03,640
He's always getting interviewed
by just.
357
00:17:04,359 --> 00:17:06,040
Interview.
Yeah, he's like very into
358
00:17:06,040 --> 00:17:07,880
patriarchy and theonomy and
these things.
359
00:17:08,160 --> 00:17:15,480
He's got a blog very famous not
his blog is called it's like GOG
360
00:17:15,480 --> 00:17:17,680
and may blog.
I don't it's like blog and yeah,
361
00:17:17,680 --> 00:17:19,280
it's like it's a play on word
with this somehow.
362
00:17:19,280 --> 00:17:20,160
I don't know what it is, but
it's.
363
00:17:20,160 --> 00:17:24,480
Pretty funny, yeah.
So anyway, we read about this
364
00:17:25,359 --> 00:17:29,280
these people groups like we
mentioned in in Scripture and
365
00:17:29,280 --> 00:17:33,240
then as you, you know, go
throughout, it's interesting
366
00:17:33,240 --> 00:17:34,840
just to think we've talked about
this a little bit, but the
367
00:17:34,840 --> 00:17:39,000
Moabites, the Ammonites, those
come from Lot Sun, so that Shim
368
00:17:39,000 --> 00:17:41,240
line, but they're like little
you see the little offshoots of
369
00:17:41,240 --> 00:17:44,040
all these different people.
So it's not like, Shim, all of
370
00:17:44,040 --> 00:17:45,080
your people are going to be
blessed.
371
00:17:45,080 --> 00:17:47,120
That's like not, that's not how
it works.
372
00:17:47,120 --> 00:17:49,440
Like, Messiah comes through
Shim's line, but there's a lot
373
00:17:49,440 --> 00:17:51,600
of people that come through
Shim's line that don't do the
374
00:17:51,600 --> 00:17:52,480
right thing.
Right.
375
00:17:52,560 --> 00:17:55,920
And so Europeans are probably
from Japheth probably.
376
00:17:55,960 --> 00:17:57,320
Probably, Yeah, I think so.
Yeah.
377
00:17:57,480 --> 00:17:59,080
OK.
Very interesting.
378
00:17:59,440 --> 00:18:02,920
And then, you know, eat them
from Esau's line, but also comes
379
00:18:02,920 --> 00:18:05,640
through shims.
And, you know, then we see, you
380
00:18:05,640 --> 00:18:08,040
know, a lot of these other
Philistines.
381
00:18:08,080 --> 00:18:09,800
Would have been from Japheth's
line.
382
00:18:11,240 --> 00:18:15,280
Yeah, I did this say.
Well, my understanding is
383
00:18:15,280 --> 00:18:18,960
Drillstein's were like from
around like Crete or the the
384
00:18:18,960 --> 00:18:21,640
Greek islands are somewhere
around there, maybe Turkey.
385
00:18:22,320 --> 00:18:29,000
Yeah, and they kind of came on,
came on over going really
386
00:18:29,000 --> 00:18:31,720
global, big picture.
What's really cool is and, and
387
00:18:31,720 --> 00:18:33,760
Clay I think made this on one of
his pockets, made this
388
00:18:33,760 --> 00:18:36,480
connection.
Acts 2 you can connect to the
389
00:18:36,480 --> 00:18:40,600
table of nations and it's almost
like verbatim the same regions
390
00:18:40,600 --> 00:18:42,320
and these.
Are the 70 different areas?
391
00:18:42,320 --> 00:18:43,600
Yeah.
Yeah, exactly.
392
00:18:43,600 --> 00:18:46,600
It almost lines up like really
perfectly, which is, it's pretty
393
00:18:46,600 --> 00:18:51,080
incredible where Pentecost is
like the undoing of the table of
394
00:18:51,080 --> 00:18:54,040
nations, where they're separate,
bringing the Gospels, going to
395
00:18:54,040 --> 00:18:54,680
everyone.
No.
396
00:18:54,840 --> 00:18:57,000
That's good.
Yeah, 'cause just recall that
397
00:18:57,000 --> 00:18:59,040
one.
The we.
398
00:18:59,120 --> 00:19:04,280
It seems as though perhaps these
different geographical areas had
399
00:19:04,280 --> 00:19:06,720
some type of watcher assigned to
them.
400
00:19:06,720 --> 00:19:08,520
Maybe one good, one bad.
Yeah.
401
00:19:08,880 --> 00:19:12,440
We get that from Daniel where
talks about, you know, the
402
00:19:12,440 --> 00:19:16,240
Prince of Persia delaying, you
know, the messenger and Michael
403
00:19:16,240 --> 00:19:19,920
the Archangel having to go over
there and and free him.
404
00:19:19,920 --> 00:19:23,800
And so we we're just kind of
grasping at the bread crumbs
405
00:19:23,800 --> 00:19:26,000
there.
But you know, if there was a
406
00:19:26,000 --> 00:19:31,280
splintering and then all that is
reunited under 1, you know, the
407
00:19:31,400 --> 00:19:36,400
the Prince of of peace, the King
of Israel, Jesus, and like we
408
00:19:36,400 --> 00:19:39,400
see in Acts 2, like, OK, now
this is all his.
409
00:19:39,640 --> 00:19:41,440
It's all.
His yeah, it speaks to God's
410
00:19:41,920 --> 00:19:43,840
sovereignty, God's hand in
history.
411
00:19:43,840 --> 00:19:45,560
You see, it's precise, it's
purposeful.
412
00:19:45,560 --> 00:19:49,440
You see this big major bookend
connections that the gospels for
413
00:19:49,440 --> 00:19:51,560
every tribe, tongue and nation.
It's not, you know, you could
414
00:19:51,560 --> 00:19:53,880
look at this and be like, you
know, what the heck?
415
00:19:53,880 --> 00:19:56,280
It's like ham gets cursed.
Curse of Ham, which we debunk
416
00:19:56,280 --> 00:19:58,160
not a thing.
It's curse of Canaan.
417
00:19:58,320 --> 00:20:00,320
And it's not like these
Canaanites didn't bring this
418
00:20:00,320 --> 00:20:02,400
judgment.
On themselves, what we talked
419
00:20:02,400 --> 00:20:04,760
about with Abraham anyway, it's
like they were, you know,
420
00:20:05,280 --> 00:20:09,040
living, living in sin.
But how God works, all these
421
00:20:09,040 --> 00:20:13,120
things together.
I see you flipping that Bible.
422
00:20:13,120 --> 00:20:16,240
What are you looking for?
I'm looking for this place
423
00:20:16,240 --> 00:20:19,720
because we just saying is he
worthy?
424
00:20:21,160 --> 00:20:27,960
And it quotes from Revelation 5.
And this is one of my favorite
425
00:20:27,960 --> 00:20:30,120
lines.
I get a little emotional reading
426
00:20:30,120 --> 00:20:31,440
it, thinking about it, singing
it.
427
00:20:32,000 --> 00:20:35,840
But this is Revelation 59 and it
says, and they sang a new song
428
00:20:35,840 --> 00:20:39,400
saying, 'cause this is after
there's a scroll, just kind of
429
00:20:39,400 --> 00:20:43,320
back up a little bit just to put
people in John there and like no
430
00:20:43,320 --> 00:20:45,560
one can open the scroll.
Who's worthy to open the scroll?
431
00:20:45,960 --> 00:20:50,520
And they find one who looks like
a lamb who's been slain, the
432
00:20:50,520 --> 00:20:52,760
lion of Judah.
And he is able to take the
433
00:20:52,760 --> 00:20:55,240
scroll and open it.
And when he does that, it says,
434
00:20:55,240 --> 00:20:59,120
and they sing a new song that
says, worthy are you to take the
435
00:20:59,120 --> 00:21:02,080
book and break its seals?
For you were slain and purchase
436
00:21:02,080 --> 00:21:07,600
for God with your blood men from
every tribe and tongue and
437
00:21:07,600 --> 00:21:12,640
people and nations, and you have
made them a Kingdom and priest
438
00:21:12,640 --> 00:21:15,600
to our God, and they will reign
upon the earth.
439
00:21:16,520 --> 00:21:24,480
And then there's places where it
talks about all of the people,
440
00:21:24,480 --> 00:21:28,240
like singing together like this,
this choir of all the people
441
00:21:28,240 --> 00:21:30,520
together.
So I just think it's a great
442
00:21:30,520 --> 00:21:35,360
picture of, you know, the
diversity that we have in
443
00:21:35,360 --> 00:21:38,280
humanity, different cultures,
different, you know, looks
444
00:21:38,280 --> 00:21:42,280
different, you know, abilities
and, you know, traits and stuff.
445
00:21:42,440 --> 00:21:45,560
But God's redeeming some from
all of those.
446
00:21:45,560 --> 00:21:48,520
And we are going to be 1 bride
for him in the future.
447
00:21:48,760 --> 00:21:50,240
Yeah.
It's it's amazing.
448
00:21:50,680 --> 00:21:53,040
I love.
And in Revelation 7, where it's
449
00:21:53,040 --> 00:21:55,000
kind of similar to what you
read, it's like there's a
450
00:21:55,000 --> 00:21:58,080
multitude no one could number.
Like it's just like endless.
451
00:21:58,480 --> 00:22:00,400
And I like that.
So we look to the future and
452
00:22:00,400 --> 00:22:03,160
that that's the trajectory of
where everything's going.
453
00:22:03,920 --> 00:22:06,680
We see like kind of where things
started in the table of nations
454
00:22:06,680 --> 00:22:09,520
and the Tower of Babel and
things get all dispersed.
455
00:22:10,120 --> 00:22:12,520
And then Acts 2 was kind of like
that already.
456
00:22:12,520 --> 00:22:14,120
Not yet.
So but we're not, we're not
457
00:22:14,120 --> 00:22:16,600
total revelation.
That's a good trajectory.
458
00:22:16,600 --> 00:22:19,600
We, we want to, it's going to be
imperfect, but it's like, man,
459
00:22:19,600 --> 00:22:22,680
that, that is really, really
cool.
460
00:22:23,400 --> 00:22:26,360
Just all the unity and
diversity.
461
00:22:26,360 --> 00:22:29,120
Because you look at the other
side of it, Galatians 3, there's
462
00:22:29,120 --> 00:22:31,680
neither Jew nor Greek, there's
neither slave nor free.
463
00:22:31,680 --> 00:22:34,200
There's no male and female for
you all, all you are all one in
464
00:22:34,200 --> 00:22:36,560
Christ.
Nothing brings you that merit.
465
00:22:37,080 --> 00:22:39,560
So you know, number one, I, I
was in this, I was looking at
466
00:22:39,560 --> 00:22:41,120
this talk one time.
I was really good and it was
467
00:22:41,120 --> 00:22:44,400
about culture.
And it was saying culture is
468
00:22:44,400 --> 00:22:48,480
really important.
But you know, Christ that that's
469
00:22:48,480 --> 00:22:50,320
number one point.
If your culture does not line up
470
00:22:50,320 --> 00:22:53,360
with Christ and every culture's
got its things that don't line
471
00:22:53,360 --> 00:22:55,600
up with scripture.
That's number one thing.
472
00:22:56,080 --> 00:22:59,840
Culture's important, but it's
like a a a secondary thing and
473
00:22:59,840 --> 00:23:04,480
it's kind of that's AI think
tough to, you know, find the
474
00:23:04,920 --> 00:23:08,040
where it is.
Culture may make sense and fit
475
00:23:08,040 --> 00:23:12,200
in, but this passage is great
because nothing, nothing merits
476
00:23:12,200 --> 00:23:13,800
your salvation.
But at the same time, Paul's got
477
00:23:13,800 --> 00:23:16,960
a lot to say about, you know,
male and female.
478
00:23:16,960 --> 00:23:19,440
We wouldn't say it obliterates
these differences.
479
00:23:19,440 --> 00:23:21,200
Do you know what I'm saying?
You can read it too far.
480
00:23:21,200 --> 00:23:23,560
It's like, so if we're saying
there is a difference between
481
00:23:23,560 --> 00:23:25,960
male and female, not and how it
merits your salvation, but there
482
00:23:25,960 --> 00:23:29,040
is a difference, Paul's
presumably saying June or Greek,
483
00:23:29,040 --> 00:23:30,480
there are good differences there
too.
484
00:23:30,480 --> 00:23:32,640
We're not saying you have to
obliterate those differences,
485
00:23:32,680 --> 00:23:33,920
right?
Yeah, I I think it would be a
486
00:23:33,920 --> 00:23:39,560
mistake to say we become that
that the the best solution is 1
487
00:23:39,560 --> 00:23:42,280
emulsified culture across all
the earth.
488
00:23:43,120 --> 00:23:45,520
And it should be fill in the
blank, this culture, because
489
00:23:45,520 --> 00:23:47,520
different cultures have
strengths and weaknesses.
490
00:23:47,520 --> 00:23:51,920
And, you know, just like the
gifts, you know, the gifts are
491
00:23:51,920 --> 00:23:55,280
handed out different strengths
and weaknesses, you know, You
492
00:23:55,280 --> 00:23:58,840
know, when something goes wrong,
I'm always trying to figure out
493
00:23:58,840 --> 00:24:00,360
how do we prevent this from
happening again?
494
00:24:00,360 --> 00:24:01,240
That's good.
Yeah.
495
00:24:01,680 --> 00:24:02,240
Right, right.
May not.
496
00:24:02,240 --> 00:24:04,200
Be good in the moment when
someone's just dropped
497
00:24:04,200 --> 00:24:06,440
something, I'm like, OK, this is
what happened wrong.
498
00:24:06,440 --> 00:24:08,240
Don't do this again.
You know this, fix it.
499
00:24:08,960 --> 00:24:11,280
But you might need someone with
the gift of mercy to come on and
500
00:24:11,280 --> 00:24:12,760
say.
Yeah, in the same.
501
00:24:12,760 --> 00:24:15,480
Way with different cultures, you
know, and there could be there
502
00:24:15,480 --> 00:24:18,000
can be bad cultures and.
And there can be bad cultures or
503
00:24:18,000 --> 00:24:23,160
a lot, a lot of it is is bad.
I think it's it's easy to maybe
504
00:24:23,160 --> 00:24:25,760
be blind to some things in your
own culture and it's easy to
505
00:24:25,840 --> 00:24:26,840
it's just like with anything
else.
506
00:24:26,840 --> 00:24:29,840
It's easy to see, you know, the
other person's faults really
507
00:24:29,840 --> 00:24:31,280
easily.
And even in this is not what
508
00:24:31,280 --> 00:24:34,080
this is necessarily about, but
even the the neither slave nor
509
00:24:34,080 --> 00:24:36,280
free, you know, not talking
about chattel slavery, but maybe
510
00:24:36,280 --> 00:24:39,400
an instrument.
There's in hierarchy might be
511
00:24:39,400 --> 00:24:41,640
the right word, wrong word, but
an order.
512
00:24:41,720 --> 00:24:44,240
There's like an ordering in
society and that does reflect
513
00:24:44,240 --> 00:24:46,480
God too.
Not saying everything's always
514
00:24:46,480 --> 00:24:49,400
just, but there are like gifting
different roles.
515
00:24:49,400 --> 00:24:52,160
Some people are are kings and
some people aren't, and some.
516
00:24:52,160 --> 00:24:54,400
People are employees, some
people are employers.
517
00:24:54,480 --> 00:24:57,720
You could use the same same type
of division for like a
518
00:24:57,720 --> 00:25:00,400
capitalistic society, which is
different than their society
519
00:25:00,400 --> 00:25:01,520
might.
Then you know I.
520
00:25:01,560 --> 00:25:04,200
I, I think that that's exactly
right.
521
00:25:04,200 --> 00:25:06,840
So anyway, I, I think it's
interesting as we're talking
522
00:25:06,840 --> 00:25:11,240
about Abraham to think about,
you know, leading up to Abraham
523
00:25:11,240 --> 00:25:14,240
and all, you know, and it's even
even interesting how Abraham's
524
00:25:14,240 --> 00:25:17,800
journey and geography and that
kind of thing to consider
525
00:25:17,800 --> 00:25:21,480
Genesis 10, consider Genesis 11,
maybe read Acts 2.
526
00:25:21,880 --> 00:25:26,880
It'd be Michael Heizer does have
a talk where he brings this up
527
00:25:27,720 --> 00:25:32,440
and he does a good job of like
mapping those things together.
528
00:25:32,440 --> 00:25:34,440
Like it says this here, it says
this here, this is how they're
529
00:25:34,440 --> 00:25:35,720
the same.
And it's like perfect.
530
00:25:35,720 --> 00:25:41,640
And you can really see how
Pentecost does just overlap that
531
00:25:41,640 --> 00:25:46,200
table of nations so, so well.
So anyway, I like those big
532
00:25:46,200 --> 00:25:50,080
picture connecting the dots, you
know, something, something to
533
00:25:50,080 --> 00:25:51,040
think about.
No, that's.
534
00:25:51,040 --> 00:25:52,000
Good.
Very good, very good.
535
00:25:52,160 --> 00:25:56,240
And it's part of the it's
probably, you know, we last
536
00:25:56,400 --> 00:25:58,880
Tuesday's episode was on Abraham
and Isaac.
537
00:25:59,000 --> 00:26:01,320
Yeah.
You probably have that if you if
538
00:26:01,320 --> 00:26:02,720
you're in the church scene.
Yeah.
539
00:26:02,760 --> 00:26:05,480
You probably had that as a
Sunday school lesson multiple
540
00:26:05,480 --> 00:26:06,200
times.
That's right.
541
00:26:06,200 --> 00:26:08,920
Yeah, you probably.
Didn't have table on nations as
542
00:26:08,920 --> 00:26:10,360
a Sunday school lesson.
Yeah, that's.
543
00:26:10,360 --> 00:26:11,440
True that.
That's a good point.
544
00:26:11,440 --> 00:26:13,000
And it's one of those when
you're doing your Bible reading,
545
00:26:13,000 --> 00:26:15,240
it's easy to kind of like.
Why ISIS here?
546
00:26:15,240 --> 00:26:17,440
Just OK, I've.
Got to I'm skipping through
547
00:26:17,440 --> 00:26:20,280
this, but in the light it's
like, and you might think that,
548
00:26:20,280 --> 00:26:22,080
but in the light of the
connection facts, she's like,
549
00:26:22,080 --> 00:26:26,200
wow, all these details.
That's pretty pretty cool that
550
00:26:26,680 --> 00:26:30,960
they the right Moses didn't just
leave it at Shem Ham Japheth,
551
00:26:31,200 --> 00:26:34,040
but he actually like broke down
this kind of stuff even more.
552
00:26:34,040 --> 00:26:37,240
And I think it's a bigger maybe
we can do a hopefully this would
553
00:26:37,240 --> 00:26:42,080
not be a boring podcast, but do
a podcast on genealogies because
554
00:26:42,080 --> 00:26:44,880
I think, you know, most of the
time when genealogies are in
555
00:26:44,880 --> 00:26:47,320
scripture, it's not just for
nothing.
556
00:26:47,320 --> 00:26:49,960
A lot of times there's a feel
logical emphasis on top of the
557
00:26:49,960 --> 00:26:51,760
historical emphasis.
If you read the names.
558
00:26:53,000 --> 00:26:55,760
It was an elaborate plan to get.
I want you to repeat it as your
559
00:26:55,760 --> 00:26:57,400
name.
I just you're always reading
560
00:26:57,400 --> 00:26:58,120
names.
That's great.
561
00:26:59,160 --> 00:27:02,360
But it it'd be interesting to
take just genealogies and and
562
00:27:02,360 --> 00:27:05,480
see like, OK, what's the
emphasis here?
563
00:27:05,480 --> 00:27:08,000
Like, why are we skipping these
people but not these people?
564
00:27:08,000 --> 00:27:10,400
Like what's the author?
Like, why are we even doing
565
00:27:10,400 --> 00:27:11,400
this?
And usually there's a good
566
00:27:11,440 --> 00:27:13,800
reason we should.
Ask Jonathan White, but this
567
00:27:13,800 --> 00:27:17,280
would be a good test for him and
and because when I was his youth
568
00:27:17,280 --> 00:27:20,440
group leader, we went through
the genealogy of Christ and if
569
00:27:20,440 --> 00:27:22,960
there was anything at all to say
about someone, we had like a
570
00:27:22,960 --> 00:27:26,120
lesson or you know, to so we
talked about Adam and we went
571
00:27:26,320 --> 00:27:27,240
through.
That and we.
572
00:27:27,240 --> 00:27:30,240
Just went from Adam all the way
to Christ, the different ones.
573
00:27:30,240 --> 00:27:33,000
And of course you get a lot of
ones in the middle that you
574
00:27:33,000 --> 00:27:36,480
don't have really anything to
say about because all you have
575
00:27:36,480 --> 00:27:37,960
is their name.
But they're all the ones that
576
00:27:37,960 --> 00:27:40,360
we'd had something to say about.
We talked about, you know, David
577
00:27:40,360 --> 00:27:44,960
and Solomon and, you know, Judah
and all the ones in between.
578
00:27:45,320 --> 00:27:46,920
Jesse.
Yeah.
579
00:27:46,920 --> 00:27:50,240
That that is really good because
those are the parts of Scripture
580
00:27:50,240 --> 00:27:54,560
which it is easy to be like we
got you know, we're just going
581
00:27:54,560 --> 00:27:57,160
to zoom through all these but
they're they're they're in there
582
00:27:57,520 --> 00:28:01,240
for a reason.
I don't know how many more
583
00:28:01,240 --> 00:28:03,240
Abraham adjacent ones.
I think I got one more.
584
00:28:03,600 --> 00:28:06,560
It's it's pretty adjacent, but
we're going to we can we can
585
00:28:06,600 --> 00:28:08,880
connect it OK, it's.
Not adjacent.
586
00:28:08,880 --> 00:28:11,680
It's cattywampus.
That's cute.
587
00:28:11,680 --> 00:28:13,440
It's diagonal too.
That's right.
588
00:28:13,440 --> 00:28:15,520
Yeah, we need to keep getting
words that farther and farther
589
00:28:15,520 --> 00:28:16,960
away.
Then maybe we'll totally wrap
590
00:28:16,960 --> 00:28:17,960
up.
I'm trying to think of anything
591
00:28:17,960 --> 00:28:20,080
I can.
I like having a nice series.
592
00:28:20,080 --> 00:28:23,440
I've got like a few ideas, but
they're just quick hitters,
593
00:28:23,440 --> 00:28:24,480
disconnected, you know?
Sure.
594
00:28:24,760 --> 00:28:27,600
We can have some mini series, so
yeah, anyway.
595
00:28:27,720 --> 00:28:29,640
That's all I got on this one.
You got anything you want to
596
00:28:29,640 --> 00:28:31,040
add?
No, I think that's good.
597
00:28:31,720 --> 00:28:36,560
All right, that's our take.
Thanks for listening to Take 2.
598
00:28:37,280 --> 00:28:39,880
Find us wherever you find
podcasts and on YouTube for
599
00:28:39,880 --> 00:28:41,600
those who want to watch our
video cast.